Operation So Roarful

SOSEN: Distorted Worldview and Deplorable Methodology

2010-05-23T10:18:00.000-07:00

SOhopeful International Renounces Radical Extremist Splinter Organization

SOhopeful International is not affiliated with S.O.S.E.N. in any way. We hereby publicly renounce and condemn S.O.S.E.N. (Sex Offender Solutions and Education Network) as an extremist and radical organization whose purpose only narrowly shadows that of our own.

-- S.O.S.E.N. is a splinter group founded by disgruntled former members of SOhopeful International. Their worldview is totally distorted and their methods are deplorable. We therefore publicly withdraw any support or affiliation from said organization.

Any organization that would even think making a naked sex offender calendar is a viable fundraising idea is out of touch with reality," says Carolyn, Executive Director of SOhopeful International. We completely disavow that group. It does not deserve our respect, nor to use our name in their communications. Our organization is credible, legitimate, rational and dedicated to legal political activism through public education and outreach."

SOhopeful International is a member-based organization that seeks to educate the public, legislators, and the media about the low recidivism rate of the majority of former sex offenders, (like the founder of Sohopeful the greatest pedophile on the internet: Jim Freeman) the efficacy of various treatment methods, and offers support, networking, and continuing education opportunities to our members. We are working to reform the laws governing the registration and sometimes life-long monitoring and tracking of low-level, non-violent lowest-risk former offenders.

We use responsible, rational and legal means to accomplish our goals and do not need to resort to belligerence or misquoting statistics out of context. We are very careful to correctly cite references and respect the copyright of previously published works.

Our members are fully equipped to present positive and solution-oriented correspondence to our legislators and the media as part of our political action activities. We strive to remain positive and behave in a manner that reflects the Creed and Member Principles of our organization. We must hold ourselves to a higher standard to prove to the world that our position is cogent and we are legitimate.

SOhopeful International actively seeks to network and collaborate with other respectable and legitimate human, civil and constitutional rights as well as judicial reform groups. We believe that cooperation and collaboration can facilitate more productive projects by pooling resources, cross-publicizing and co-sponsoring events.

SOhopeful International (although only lay persons do our best to educate the experts) using traditional and legal methods to educate the public, legislators, interested professionals and the media about the recidivism rate of former sex offenders and how Jim Freeman claiming to be reformed and trying to make people believe he was one of the "low risk" offenders while running this organization and an international pedophile ring doesn't really mean anything.

We invite you to visit www.sohopeful.org for more information, or join us at www.sohopeful.org/forum/

Nambla - Who we are

2008-09-30T23:57:00.000-07:00

WHO WE ARE

WELCOME! The North American Man/Boy Love Association (NAMBLA) was formed in 1978. It was inspired by the success of a campaign based in Boston's gay community to defend against a local witchhunt.

NAMBLA's goal is to end the extreme oppression of men and boys in mutually consensual relationships by:

building understanding and support for such relationships;
educating the general public on the benevolent nature of man/boy love;
cooperating with lesbian, gay, feminist, and other liberation movements;
supporting the liberation of persons of all ages from sexual prejudice and oppression.

Our membership is open to everyone sympathetic to man/boy love and personal freedom.

NAMBLA calls for the empowerment of youth in all areas, not just the sexual. We support greater economic, political and social opportunities for young people and denounce the rampant ageism that segregates and isolates them in fear and mistrust. We believe sexual feelings are a positive life force. We support the rights of youth as well as adults to choose the partners with whom they wish to share and enjoy their bodies.

We condemn sexual abuse and all forms of coercion. Freely-chosen relationships differ from unwanted sex. Present laws, which focus only on the age of the participants, ignore the quality of their relationships. We know that differences in age do not preclude mutual, loving interaction between persons. NAMBLA is strongly opposed to age-of-consent laws and all other restrictions which deny men and boys the full enjoyment of their bodies and control over their own lives.

NAMBLA does not provide encouragement, referrals or assistance for people seeking sexual contacts. NAMBLA does not engage in any activities that violate the law, nor do we advocate that anyone else should do so.

We call for fundamental reform of the laws regarding relations between youths and adults. Today, many thousands of men and boys are unjustly ground into the disfunctional criminal justice system. Blindly, this system condemns consensual, loving relationships between younger and older people. NAMBLA's Prisoner Program, with limited resources, works to provide a modicum of humanity to some of these people. Click here to find out more.

NAMBLA is a political, civil rights, and educational organization. We provide factual information and help educate society about the positive and beneficial nature of man/boy love. Become an active member! You can help in this historic struggle!

RSOL - The How

2008-09-30T23:56:00.000-07:00

Ken Lanning:

There are also several organizations in this country and around the world that
openly voice a far different attitude about adult sex with children. The Rene Guyon Society, North American Man/Boy Love Association (NAMBLA), Pedophile Information Exchange (PIE), Child Sensuality Circle, the Pedo-Alert Network (PAN), and Lewis Carroll Collector’s Guild are all examples of groups that at one time or another have openly advocated adult-child sex and changing the laws that make it a crime. These groups usually restrict their advocacy to “consenting” sexual activity with children and claim to be opposed to forced sex with children. Such groups move in and out of existence as active members come and go, but the attitudes persist.

In spite of the attention that many of these organizations have received in the past, it is doubtful that they have had any significant impact on public opinion in general within the United States. Their greatest threat to society, other than the criminal acts of individual members, is as a source of support and validation for child molesters and pedophiles. These groups and the material they publish help child molesters justify their behavior. Many pedophiles are openly proud of their behavior. In her outstanding article, “The Indignant Page: Techniques of Neutralization in the Publications of Pedophile Organizations,” Dr. Mary De Young identifies the three neutralization techniques of such pedophiles as denial of injury (no harm done to child victim); denial of the victim (child deserved or brought on the behavior); and appeal to higher loyalty (insistence that behavior serves the interests of a higher principle such as liberation of children or artistic freedom) (De Young, 1988). To some extent the Internet has made such groups obsolete. One no longer needs to join NAMBLA to get active validation for a sexual attraction to children. People can go on the Internet anytime of the day and find hundreds of others willing to actively validate their commonly held perverted interests.

Interestingly a few academics, mental-health professionals, and sexologists express similar views. These so-called “experts” on human sexual behavior sometimes equate the existing laws that prohibit sex with children with laws that prohibit masturbation, fornication, and homosexuality. They advocate changing the laws so that children can choose their sexual partners freely, but under the guise of children’s rights and freedom.

Reform Sex Offender Laws Campaign 2007

Abolish all provisions of state and Federal sex offender registries that publicly shame offenders.
Abolish all life-time civil commitment for sex offenders who have completed prison sentences and/or parole and probation.
Stop public vilification and demonization of sex offenders. Children should be defined as persons under the age of puberty.
De-criminalize all consensual sexual activities among teenagers.
Abolish all laws that provide the death penalty or life in prison without parole for sex offenders.
Support broad sex education for children, and empower them to make their own decisions and stand up for their rights.
Provide accurate information and support valid research about sex offender characteristics and recidivism rates
Help sex offenders re-enter society by abolishing measures which make it difficult for them to find a place to live and a decent job.

A CALL TO SAFEGUARD OUR CHILDREN AND OUR LIBERTIES 1998

Subject: AUT: A Call to Safeguard Our Children and Our Libreties

* From: Chris
* Date: Mon, 29 Jun 1998 21:15:05 -0700 (PDT)

A CALL TO SAFEGUARD OUR CHILDREN AND OUR LIBERTIES {This is the statement of an informal group of Boston-area educators, health workers, criminal justice workers and other community activists. This statement is circulated to individuals and organizations to initiate discussion, and for additional signatures. It is hoped that others will endorse this call, or will formulate their own statement, tailored to their own communities.} As people concerned about children’s welfare and a just society, we speak out against the troubling direction of current campaigns to protect children from vaguely defined sexual dangers by criminalizing and scapegoating a wide range of people and behaviors. These approaches often ignore the realities of childhood and adolescent sexuality and they sometimes equate affection with violence. They distract us from the problem of far more serious forms of violence against children and young people. They erode essential freedoms for everyone. Current hysteria is so pervasive that anyone who suggests a more thoughtful discussion risks being branded a child abuser. To truly protect children as well as empower them to be themselves, and to protect a free society, we insist on a more sensible and compassionate approach.

The real challenge is to support and expand programs for children and youth
which develop caring, loving, thoughtful, whole human beings. Among these are day care, after-school care, sex positive sex education, and better training and pay for those who work with children. The aim of all these programs should be to empower young people to learn to make their own decisions about their lives. Children and youth need to view themselves not as potential victims, but as part of a community which supports and nurtures them, encouraging them to speak up and act responsibly on their own beliefs. We want children to love life, not fear it. If this is to happen, there must be adults courageous enough to demand an honest and constructive approach to sex and youth and to call for an end to the prevailing hysteria. Only then will we be able to safeguard the liberties we all need to develop fully.

SIGNED: Dr. Richard Pillard, psychiatrist; Paul Shannon, educator; Cathy
Hoffman, peace activist; Chris Tilly, economics professor; Marie Kennedy, community planning professor; Eric Entemann, mathematics professor; Tom Reeves, social science professor; Bob Chatelle, writer & anti-censorship activist; and Jim D’Entremont, playwright & anti-censorship activist; Ann Kotell, health worker; Carol Thomas, social justice and religious activist;
French Wall and Bill Andriette, gay writers and editors; Nancy Ryan, feminist activist; Reebee Garofalo, popular culture professor; Dianne McLaughlin, community & criminal justice worker; John Miller, economics professor; Molly Mead, urban social planning professor; John MacDougall,
sociology professor; Laurie Dougherty, social science researcher & editor; Monty Neill, educator & political activist; Rev. Margaret Hougen & Rev. Edward Hougen; Roswitha and Ernest Winsor, criminal justice advocates; Paula Westberg, teacher; Rosalyn Baxandall, American Studies professor & community activist (New York); and others…
For information, call Paul Shannon at (617) 497-5273; or email Chris Tilly
at chris_tilly@xxxxxxx

Bill Andriette:

1991 September: Bill Andriette, editor of the North American Man-Boy Love Association’s NAMBLA Newsletter and affiliate of Paidika: The Journal of Paedophilia in his Playboy article, “Are You A Child Pornographer?” warned, “The Feds have now also criminalized a range of images that no one could possibly view as harmful to society or to children.” Playboy concealed Andriette’s pedophilia and said only that he was “features editor of The Guide, a Boston-based gay magazine”

1992 March: Playboy again describes pedophile Lawrence Stanley as a child abuse expert. Andriette, Petersen and Stanley cite each other in seeking to reverse the US. vs. Stephen A. Knox child “panty pornography” conviction. Petersen in Playboy conceals Stanley’s and Andriette’s pedophilia, warning: “When the government looks at [Knox's] innocent material with a pedophile’s eyes, justice suffers” (p 46). A year later Attorney General Reno asked the U.S. Supreme Court to reverse Knox.

An age-blind society is not the goal; one in which a person’s age does not radically affect the way he or she is treated is. The differences between a seven-year-old and a 37-year-old are too great not to be articulated in social policy. Age restrictions on motor vehicle operations or voting rights should be tolerated. To let drivers be of any age would expose people to a probable danger. To leave voting unrestricted would be putting forth a woefully attenuated definition of citizenship in which the voter’s duties could be carried out without even the guidance of much experience.

But society has erred on the side of restriction in its dealing with youth. A view of children as something less than human has been the backdrop to a host of oppressive measures that have showed neither young people nor adults at their best. Any improvement demands not just the humanization of childhood, but a shift toward a rational and just society.

from NAMBLA JOURNAL SIX (1983), Pgs. 6-7.

From the Jeffrey Curley wrongful death lawsuit:

Working in Massachusetts, Andriette served as the editor of the Bulletin and Gayme Magazine. He did not act alone but rather under the supervision of the Steering Committee in producing these publications and in holding himself out as a NAMBLA spokesman. In addition to the financial support and supervision provided by the full Steering Committee, the content of the Bulletin was guided by the “Bulletin Collective,” an editorial board comprised of NAMBLA members from across the country who contributed and edited articles, screened photos and pictures, and participated in coordinating the production and distribution of the publication. In sum, there is ample support in the record for the conclusion that the financial, political, legal, and public outreach activities of NAMBLA, Zymurgy, Inc., the Bulletin, Ariel’s Pages, and Gayme Magazine were managed by NAMBLA’s Steering Committee to further the organization’s purposes.

RSOL - The Why

2008-09-30T23:55:00.000-07:00

"Pedophiles like Pentlarge are the “elite” of child molesters: men who are smart and likeable, with the kind of traits and habits human resource types call “good interpersonal skills.” And most perpetrators, Lanning said, need every ounce of sophistication and savvy to keep their house of cards from collapsing. "

How a prominent Ware attorney preyed on troubled boys - and why some people in town continue to stand by him.

Joel Pentlarge was a pillar of the community. A lawyer by trade, he built himself a reputation as a civic missionary, donating hour upon hour to Ware’s governmental boards, first as a selectman, then on the conservation commission, where he fought to protect the old mill town’s fragile wetlands and foothills.

Social activism came second nature to Pentlarge, a sign of his pedigree in an affluent New England family. His mother, the late Frances “Effie” Eaton Pentlarge, taught by example: An esteemed member of Maine’s politically progressive circles, Effie Pentlarge crusaded for social justice. In the early- to mid-1990s she helped revive a decades-old political movement to extend civil rights to gay and lesbian Mainers and co-founded Parents and Friends of Lesbians and Gays in Maine to build bridges between gay and straight people.

Effie Pentlarge’s oldest son also professed a deep concern for social justice. Joel Pentlarge directed his altruism toward down-and-out children and families. The primary beneficiary of the lawyer’s largess was Valley Human Services, a not-for-profit social services agency in Ware that provides a range of support services, including sexual abuse counseling, to low-income clients. Pentlarge not only offered pro bono legal work to the $1.8 million-a-year state-funded agency, he also served on its board for 18 years. He was one of VHS’s most loyal champions and benefactors.

On the side, he took a special interest in young street toughs, boys who had trouble with the law or at school and, quite often, with their families. He employed them as handymen at his various rental properties in town. But more than that, he took them under his wing.

Sure, there were whispers: What did Pentlarge really want with these troubled boys? He was an out gay man, out and proud. When accusations of child molestation surfaced in the mid-1980s, Pentlarge and his friends deflected them by crying prejudice and homophobia. Well-meaning people were intimidated by the insinuation that questioning Pentlarge’s motives was an act of bigotry, that it fed into a detestable stereotype that suggests gays are pedophiles at heart.

But the whispers persisted. By the early 1990s, the volume grew loud enough to reach the ears of the state police. And then, investigators say, the boys themselves balked. They agreed to tell their stories, but hesitated to testify — out of fear and shame and, perhaps, admiration. Or even love.

“He raised children to a level of understanding and respect that all kids want,” said Assistant District Attorney Alex Nappan, who prosecuted Pentlarge last summer on five counts of child rape, sex crimes that began in 1985 and ended in 1998 just before a grand jury returned the first of five indictments against Pentlarge.

“All kids want to be heard and understood,” Nappan said. “Joel respected kids to the point where he gave them the opportunity to make decisions that society doesn’t let them.”

By all outward indications, Pentlarge was unfazed by the state police investigation and others undertaken by the state Department of Social Services and the Massachusetts Board of Bar Overseers. Despite the heightened scrutiny, the prospect of public disclosure, the danger to his career, Pentlarge continued to pursue boys who needed guidance and money, and to groom them for sex.

For 15 years Pentlarge masked his pedophilia with his professional stature, his social position and civic good deeds, while other pillars of the community stood silently by, largely deaf and blind to his crimes. Pentlarge preyed on some of Ware’s most vulnerable and troubled boys, using money and alcohol — peppered with affection and attention — to extract sex.

That much Pentlarge admitted when he accepted the July 31, 2000, plea agreement that placed him behind bars at MCI Cedar Junction for a mere three to four years, a remarkably light sentence that Judge C. Brian McDonald accepted with great hesitation, insisting the plea agreement was far too lenient for the crimes Pentlarge committed.

Yet for many of Ware’s “substantial citizens” — a term McDonald used at sentencing to refer to Pentlarge’s apologists — any time at all was too harsh a punishment. Nearly a dozen friends, businesspeople, former town officials and, in one instance, a lawyer for DSS, offered their support in writing to the court. Many continue to support him today.

Few crimes elicit a more visceral reaction than child sexual abuse. Yet when we wring our hands and ask, “How does something like this happen?” the best answer may be “How doesn’t it happen more often?” The Pentlarge case demonstrates how easy it is for society to remain blind to child sexual assault, especially when the victims are adolescent boys. It also shows that when the perpetrator is an otherwise upstanding member of the community and his victims are tainted by troubled pasts, it is painfully easy for justice to be denied.

Joel Pentlarge lit on Massachusetts State Police radar screens five years before investigators and the Northwestern District Attorney’s Office were able to collect all the necessary elements of a successful prosecution.

Court records show that as early as 1993 state police had spoken with boys they suspected had been molested by Pentlarge. Investigators say the boys were unwilling to testify, and without cooperative victims who were willing to testify before a grand jury, the state’s case was fatally weak. The rapes continued.

In 1998 investigators got two big breaks. First, State Police Investigator Sgt. Sue Cronin, who declined to be interviewed for this story, uncovered a potentially damaging pair of letters between Pentlarge and long-time friend Tara Lindquist. In the first letter, which Lindquist sent to Pentlarge in May 1984, she inquires about his seeming fascination with adolescent boys. In his June 1984 response, Pentlarge gives a seven-page explanation of why his sexual attraction to minor boys is normal and natural and even morally defensible.

“It reads like a pamphlet for NAMBLA,” Nappan said, referring to the North American Man/Boy Love Association, a controversial organization that promotes the view that sex between adult men and boys is natural and should be decriminalized.

In the letter, which Judge McDonald sealed from public view but quoted from in his sentencing, Pentlarge defends pedophilia and tries to distance himself from the “stereotypical pedophile who uses candy, drugs, force or trickery to garner the sexual involvement of an unsuspecting child unbeknownst to his parents.”

Lindquist had sent copies of the correspondence between her and Pentlarge to DSS. After the agency decided not to pursue a full-fledged investigation, it destroyed the letters, as is standard DSS policy, Nappan said. Sgt. Cronin, who had spent years investigating Pentlarge, knew of Lindquist’s letters to DSS. When Cronin found out Pentlarge’s DSS file had expired, she went to the source. Pentlarge’s friend had kept copies of both letters and turned them over to Nappan.

But the letters alone were of only limited use as evidence in a criminal case in Massachusetts. In his letter to Lindquist Pentlarge did not admit to any specific illegal activity involving any of the boys who eventually testified before the grand jury. Instead, Pentlarge offered a stunningly cogent defense of his sexual interest in minor boys.

Investigators’ next important break came when three boys agreed to add their voices to two others who had already resolved to tell their stories to a grand jury. Together, their stories told a far more comprehensive and compelling story of abuse and detailed a pattern of victimization that had continued virtually unabated from 1985 to 1998. By late 1999 grand juries had handed up five indictments containing the accounts of four different victims who testified that Pentlarge had raped them.

By the time prosecutors officially accused Pentlarge of raping four boys, he all but embodied the stereotypical pedophile he had described in his 1984 letter to Lindquist. Instead of the “candy, drugs, force or trickery” Pentlarge listed as the pathetic lures of the run-of-the-mill pedophile, however, he used attention, affection and hard cash to get what he wanted.

In one account included in court records, two boys explain how, several weeks into a regular gig doing odd jobs for Pentlarge, he called them into an apartment he maintained above his Prospect Street law offices. Then he broke out the rum and Coke.

“Ours were strong. His looked kind of weak,” the boy testified. “We had a good buzz going.”

Pentlarge then asked the boys if they “wanted to earn extra money.”

“Yeah, that’d be cool,” the boy said. “What do we have to do?”

According to the boy’s grand jury testimony, Pentlarge replied, “Would you like to go into the bedroom?”

“When we went into the bedroom things kind of changed,” the boy testified. “We thought at first we would watch him masturbate, but then it was for him to perform oral sex on us.”

One boy who worked for Pentlarge in the early 1990s described during the investigation how after a short stint working for Pentlarge as a hired hand, Pentlarge began asking him to come to his house at night to do work. The boy would return home with between $10 and $100, depending upon what Pentlarge was paying that night for sex. According to court records and interviews with investigators, the boy said his family knew what was going on but sent him back night after night because he was making decent money.

Tommy admits he too did it for the money. But he still considers what Pentlarge did to him rape.

Sex paid better than anything else a teenager could scrounge up in Ware, Tommy, one of the boys who testified before a grand jury, said in an interview with the Advocate. (His name, and the names of any victims referred to in this piece, have been changed to protect their identity.) He said he doesn’t have a stomach for alcohol, so he didn’t drink the rum and Cokes Pentlarge mixed for the other boys. But when you’re 15 and poor, 25 or 50 bucks in your pocket is pretty intoxicating all by itself.

“But I was hoping someone would help us,” Tommy said. “… We had investigators come up to us. We’ve had all kinds of other people come up to us and ask us about Joel. They just didn’t seem like they were interested in what we were telling them. Joel’s got money, you know.”

But things changed for Tommy one night in 1998 when he walked into a room and found Pentlarge with a younger boy, who was dressing frantically. In this boy Tommy saw his own reflection.

“When I saw Nick with Joel that night, that was it,” said Tommy, who started having sex with Pentlarge for money when he was 15 and is now in his mid-20s.

“Nick had no shirt on, Joel was putting his shirt back on and was answering the door. I said, ‘Nick, you’re coming with me.’ I grabbed him and took him to McDonald’s. … When I saw him there with Joel, I felt like I needed to protect [him and the other boys]. Without any question. He would really mess up [the other boys'] lives, too.”

Tommy decided he would cooperate fully with state police investigators and would try to get some of the other boys to join him. Pentlarge’s house of cards began to crumble.

In preparation for trial, which was to begin in mid-July 2000, Pentlarge hired Harry Miles, a skilled and prominent Northampton defense attorney. The boys, who had been looked after by Massachusetts State Police investigators throughout the grand jury inquiry and pre-trial phases, steeled themselves for the painful ordeal of cross-examination.

As victims go, these boys were no angels. The natural sympathy a prosecutor might expect from jurors seated to hear a child rape case could easily have been undermined by the boys’ own misdeeds. Several of Pentlarge’s victims had criminal records. One is now jailed in Vermont. Another was on probation at the time of the trial for sexually assaulting a young child.

On the second day of the trial, before a jury had been empanelled, Pentlarge accepted a plea agreement promising him no more than four years in prison. The plea spared the young victims the ordeal of facing the man who had effectively made prostitutes out of them; it guaranteed the district attorney that Pentlarge would do time; and it put an end to Pentlarge’s 15-year pattern of sexual abuse of Ware’s vulnerable boys and ensured he would remain on probation for life.

The deal also let Pentlarge off easy for a crime the commonwealth considers serious enough to warrant a life sentence. By contrast, one of Pentlarge’s victims, who five years after Pentlarge first raped him turned around and sexually molested two children, faces a more severe sentence for violating probation than Pentlarge received for his entire 15-year string of sexual abuse. The man has not been convicted of any additional crimes; he violated probation by not completing the sexual abuse counseling ordered by the court. In a December hearing in Franklin District Court, he was given one more chance to live up to the terms of his probation. If he fails, he faces five to seven years in prison.

Apparently, no one was more deeply troubled by Pentlarge’s light sentence than Judge McDonald, who clearly considered the three-to-four-year term a slap on the wrist. During a mid-July hearing on sentencing, McDonald scorned both the prosecution and the defense and refused to accept the plea agreement until he felt certain that signing off was not just in Pentlarge’s interest but also in the best interests of his victims. McDonald delayed sentencing to consider the matter.

On July 31 the judge entered a packed Hampshire County superior courtroom prepared to sentence Pentlarge. He had received the Hampshire County Probation Department’s report on the plea agreement assessing its suitability to the crimes. He had heard from the victims’ witnesses, advocates charged with protecting the rights of victims who are randomly dragged down the rabbit hole of the criminal justice system. And he had read the letters he had received from Pentlarge’s supporters — men and women of stature and substance who asked McDonald for mercy, something the 50-year-old attorney himself had never requested.

McDonald sat, held up the handful of those letters and spoke: “In my not so lengthy judicial career, I have not given any case greater consideration and thought regarding a sentencing decision. …

“I am shocked at some of those letters. And they disturb me greatly and make me wonder what is wrong with a society where substantial citizens believe that volunteer work for an airport or an interest in dogs or maintaining low-income residential housing or employing young people should excuse the conduct of Mr. Pentlarge and would justify a sentence that does not involve punishment by incarceration. … In my view it’s worse than naivete. In my view, these letter writers are blind to the crimes committed by the defendant.”

The letters of support were not part of the case file in Hampshire Superior Court, but the Advocate was granted permission to view them after petitioning Judge McDonald.

James P. Thomas, a retired Air Force colonel and a former Ware selectman, is among those who petitioned the judge on Pentlarge’s behalf. Thomas is now president of the Palmer Airport Association and also the CEO of Riverside Aviation Inc., an aviation dealer in Ware. Before Pentlarge’s arrest, Thomas and Pentlarge had worked closely together to preserve the community airport, which was at risk of being shut down.

When Judge McDonald castigated “substantial citizens” for being blind to Pentlarge’s crimes, he held Thomas’ letter, among others, in his hand. The crimes had taken a toll on the community, Thomas wrote. But he wasn’t referring to Pentlarge’s victims: “It would be a great loss to the community and the pilots who depend on us saving the Palmer Airport,” Thomas wrote, “if we lost [Pentlarge's] valuable legal services for a number of years.” In asking for leniency, Thomas mentioned neither Pentlarge’s crimes nor his victims.

“One of my big fears,” wrote Clifford D. Heaton, a Springfield attorney, “is that tenants will stop paying rent and building mortgages will be foreclosed so Pentlarge will lose his only source of income.”

Also among the letters pleading for leniency is one from a lawyer for DSS, Nappan said. The letter was not included in the stack McDonald released to the Advocate; Nappan, however, kept a copy in his files. “The letter from the lawyer for [the child protective agency] basically says, ‘Joel’s a good guy and shouldn’t go to jail.’ After sentencing, this same guy says to law enforcement, ‘I’m ambivalent about my role here.’”

The justifications of the letter-writers and of others interviewed by the prosecution are nothing if not callous in their disregard for the victims. Worse yet, some seem to believe Pentlarge was a “benign” perpetrator.

“How can you say that,” Nappan said, “when this was rape?”

There is a sickening irony in public accounts of the Pentlarge case: Pentlarge’s acts of social beneficence in Ware’s civic affairs and at Valley Human Services not only helped camouflage his crimes but actually enabled him to continue to victimize some of the very people VHS, and social service agencies in general, exist to help.

Investigators say allegations swirled about Pentlarge for years. Neighbors had inklings, teachers raised question, the state police had suspicions. The victims simply never had the standing or credibility or support to make their accusations against Pentlarge stick.

One victim, Tommy, claims he confided in counselors at VHS that Pentlarge was molesting him. He says he spoke with a counselor in the early 1990s. In fact, he says, the counselor initiated the conversation.

“She was a little worried about him herself,” Tommy said. “She had asked me if Joel had ever touched me and I said ‘Yeah, he has.’ I thought we’d talk about it more, but we didn’t get into it in any detail or anything. That was the only time I mentioned it. I really thought they were going to help. Nothing happened.”

Social service agencies, teachers, doctors and other professionals who are responsible for children are so-called “mandated reporters”; if they know a child is being abused, or even have a strong suspicion, they are obliged to file a complaint with DSS. Nappan said he is satisfied that Valley Human Services never withheld information to protect Pentlarge. He said there is no information to suggest that VHS broke the law.

Whether VHS did the right thing is another matter, one that will likely haunt the agency and the community it serves for a long time.

A human services professional familiar with the case said VHS counselors who treated some of the boys noted that some boys’ actions and responses to questions raised serious concerns about sexual abuse. There were suspicions about Pentlarge, the source said, but nothing ever happened because the boys never made a direct accusation.

That fact raises a troubling question for VHS: If state law mandates reporting if there is a suspicion of abuse, why didn’t VHS counselors confide in DSS? The agency’s official response, according to VHS Vice Chairman Kevin O’Regan, is that suspicion is one thing, evidence is another. There simply was no evidence that Pentlarge had done anything wrong.

One of the more troubling aspects of VHS’s association with Pentlarge is that even after the grand jury returned its multi-count rape indictment against Pentlarge, the agency itself took no action against him.

When reached by the Advocate, VHS Director Evie Glickman said she would not discuss Pentlarge. “I’m sure you can understand that this has been a very difficult time for [the agency],” Glickman said. “It’s over and we want to put it behind us.”

When asked what action the agency took against Pentlarge, Glickman acknowledged it had taken none. Pentlarge took a leave of absence in 1998 after the first indictment was handed up. When it was clear in the fall of 1999 that the DA’s office wanted to prosecute, Pentlarge resigned.

As an agency whose primary mission it is to protect and lift up the most vulnerable members of society, VHS failed. Not solely because it never saw the warning signs in one of its own, but also by remaining silent even after Pentlarge admitted he raped some of VHS’s own clients.

“Pentlarge was pretty clever,” said David Heinlein, who represents one of the boys who are seeking damages in two separate civil suits against Pentlarge. (Pentlarge’s lawyer in the civil suit, William Newman, declined to be interviewed for this story and said Pentlarge would not be interviewed either.) “His victims were individuals who had some history in terms of their own personal problems. And he created a he-said, she-said type of situation: ‘I’m Joel Pentlarge and I have a certain stature in this town and who’s going to believe you over me?’

“The second part of his justification was, ‘Even if I did what was alleged, how did I hurt you kids? You have this tainted history. You can’t ever prove that anything I did to you is any worse than what had happened to you in your own lives.’”

VHS’s O’Regan, a U.S. attorney who now heads the Justice Department’s Springfield office, joined the board in 1998, about a year before Pentlarge resigned in disgrace. O’Regan said an internal review determined that VHS officials knew nothing about Pentlarge that could or should have alerted them to his pedophilic behavior. The VHS board and the agency as a whole, O’Regan said, feel not so much a sense of guilt over Pentlarge as one of violation, an awful realization that one among them had so perversely dishonored the agency’s central mission.

“There has … been a profound effect on the board and on the agency as a whole that someone that it trusted committed such horrible crimes that were so contrary to what we as an agency try to do,” O’Regan said. “We exist to help people who are troubled and vulnerable. The fact that Joel took advantage of troubled children, that he raped them, is deeply disturbing. What Joel did was exploit the vulnerabilities of these kids, and that’s part of what is so disturbing.”

Pentlarge’s oldest victim is nearly 30 now. He could have been a VHS poster child: poor, illiterate, needy. He was 13 when the rapes began. He never learned to read or write, Nappan said. But he can fix almost anything. He now works as a mechanic in Vermont. Every day he wakes up and puts on two layers of clothes. He told Nappan he can’t stand the thought of someone undressing him.

In 1992, when he was 20, he told an investigator with the Massachusetts Board of Bar Overseers that when he was 15, “he had been forced by [Pentlarge] to have sex at least five times,” according to court files.

BBO investigator Robert Prince said in an interview with the Advocate that he investigated the complaint against Pentlarge and included the boy’s account in his final report to the BBO. But the board took no action against Pentlarge until December 2000, well after he had admitted to his 15-year string of rapes.

Neither Prince nor the BBO, which investigates allegations of professional misconduct by lawyers, will discuss the 1992 complaint against Pentlarge or the board’s inquiry into it. Earlier this month, however, the board disbarred Pentlarge, according to BBO Counsel Daniel Crane. Even so, Pentlarge may apply for reinstatement in eight years, Crane said. If the BBO’s past practices are any indication, Pentlarge stands about an 80 percent chance of practicing in Massachusetts again, according to a recent Boston Globe investigative report. Since 1990, 19 of the 25 lawyers who have been disbarred, forced to resign or indefinitely suspended have been reinstated on request, the Globe reported.

By the time Joel Pentlarge stood before Judge McDonald to hear his sentence, there was virtually no punishment that could make up for the ways in which the system had repeatedly failed his victims. Even after sentencing, justice had not truly been served, at least not in McDonald’s eyes.

“This is not an appropriate sentence for one of the crimes, let alone the five to which he has pled guilty,” McDonald said at sentencing. “And I cannot give the defendant leniency. He does not deserve leniency. He deserves punishment and scorn. …

“His life and the past 15 years have no redeeming value. For 15 years, by his own admission, he was a sexual predator, a child rapist, a molester of young boys.”

McDonald went on to say he had decided to accept the plea bargain out of respect for the victims who had been silenced by the community that held Pentlarge in such high esteem. If the boys, some of whom are now men, preferred to “avoid the public ordeal of testifying,” McDonald said, he would not force them to go to trial and bare their souls.

In retrospect, Tommy said, he wishes the judge had.

“[Pentlarge] doesn’t deserve three to four years. He deserves the rest of his life,” Tommy said. “He doesn’t even deserve his life, in my opinion. But, I don’t know, I’m not the judge.”

Pentlarge’s thoughts and motives are his own. But interviews with both his victims and his defenders and information contained in court documents and letters written on his behalf, help sketch a rough picture of him, a portrait of a man who had convinced himself that his sexual escapades, though likely to be misunderstood by the majority, were perfectly normal, or at the very least, defensible. If Pentlarge ever thought of himself as a perpetrator, he likely considered his acts “benign.”

“Some people still think we railroaded Joel,” Nappan said. “There’s still this big, unresolved issue for a lot of people. Joel broke the law, that’s clear. But what actual harm did he do? Joel would say he offered a safe, loving environment for kids from disenfranchised families. I don’t think Joel thinks he did anything wrong, but he certainly knows he did something illegal.” *

Boys Don’t Tell:
Why sex crimes against young males are tough to crack

Amassing evidence against Joel Pentlarge was relatively light work for state police and the district attorney compared to what it took to get his adolescent boy victims to testify that he had raped them.

Surveys of adults conducted over the past 20 years suggest that adolescents are the victims in 90 percent to 95 percent of all sex crimes against males, according to research conducted by the University of New Hampshire’s Crimes Against Children Research Center. Men were the perpetrators in 80 percent of the cases.

“There is the stereotypical concept that only women and children get victimized,” said Kenneth V. Lanning, supervisory special agent at the FBI Academy at Quantico, Va., and one of the agency’s top experts on sex offenders. “That’s only because boys who have been sexually victimized don’t talk.”

Lanning was slated to be an expert witness in the Pentlarge case before Pentlarge forfeited his right to a trial last July and accepted a lenient plea agreement that put him in jail for just three to four years.

One of the FBI’s leading experts on child sexual abuse, the recently retired Lanning is an alumni of both the Behavioral Science Unit that was creepily immortalized in Silence of the Lambs and the elite Missing and Exploited Children Task Force. In more than three decades tracking society’s most monstrous predators, Lanning had witnessed the “worst of the worst.” He understands perpetrators’ basic motives and methods; he knows their mind games.

Perpetrators exploit children’s’ weaknesses. The children in these cases are typically not 4-, 5- or 6-year-olds but young teenagers with complicated lives. Add poverty or family dysfunction, as was the case with most of Pentlarge’s victims, and the perpetrator’s leverage increases.

“Most kids get into this for the attention,” Lanning said. “For some there’s material gain, money, presents. And in some cases, there may even be enjoyment of the sexual activity. We don’t like to say that; we don’t like to admit that. … But that’s the truth, even though it’s almost the forbidden thing to say.

“There is no human being on the face of the earth who is easier to seduce into sexual activity than an adolescent boy,” Lanning said. “What’s the difference between seducing an adult woman and an adolescent boy?” Lanning asked abruptly. It’s a rhetorical question: “It’s about a thousand times easier to seduce a boy.”

Boys are intensely interested in sex and are actively exploring their sexuality; they are easily aroused and also sexually naïve. They are rebels with raging hormones. Because of these factors, Lanning said, teenage boys are often the targets of pedophile seduction.

But the numbers don’t show it.

Cases in which adolescent boys are the victims are among the most difficult to crack. Primarily because the stigma against homosexuality is so great, boys who are raped don’t talk — not solely out of shame or self-loathing or the simple impulse to wish it all away; boys don’t tell because they recognize, quite correctly, that society does not understand what happened to them, how they were seduced, and most pointedly, how they could let it to happen to them.

All kids crave attention, affection and kindness. What the perpetrators do in pursuit of their victims is nothing more and nothing less than seduction, Lanning said. “If this kind of activity was between two teenagers or two adults, it would be called dating,” Lanning said. “There’s a big difference, though, when this is occurring between a child or teenager and an adult, of course, because children can’t give consent.”

Pedophiles like Pentlarge are the “elite” of child molesters: men who are smart and likeable, with the kind of traits and habits human resource types call “good interpersonal skills.” And most perpetrators, Lanning said, need every ounce of sophistication and savvy to keep their house of cards from collapsing.

“Listen, have you ever tried to have sexual relationships with two, three, four people at a time? This is a delicate balancing act,” Lanning said. “These kinds of perpetrators have a lot to juggle. In the end, most of them end up making some kind of stupid mistake.”

– JoAnn DiLorenzo

Walking into Stitches hands

2008-09-30T23:42:00.000-07:00

equal justice
SOSEN Staff
Member

We had our board meeting
« on: Today at 07:39:31 PM »

We had our board meeting. It was agreed that Lets has been harassing me and pm ing and emailing people as a “war on Cheryl” and has said he has told them HIS story and “everyone” is on Let’s side.
It was agreed that Lets has been told and emailed and Pm’d over and over again in the last month and he adamantly refuses to stop.
I compromised in what I would accept several times in the meeting.
It was discussed that we need a policy.
I pointed out that we DO have a policy and have had a policy and read the policy to the board.
The policy is clear!
EVEN OUR BYLAWS ARE CLEAR! But everytime I said I wanted something, I was shot down.
Oh we should tell Lets as of today that he has to follow the policy. Yea sure, like anything else has worked with lets and HE DARN WELL KNOWS THE POLICY AND WHERE IT IS> He was in staff and discussed the policy multiple times.
SO it all kept comming down to letting Lets continue what he is doing even tho he has been told for over a month to STOP IT>
When I read the policy and that too was shot down in Lets favor I just said ok you can have lets…I quit..
The choice for me was that I either let lets continue what he has publicly declaired he is going to keep doing and just deal with it, or I go. I think I have made it quite clear for the last 3 days that I have had enough of being abused and maligned on my own forum.
The 3 other members of the BOD that were there, LINDA
OH and Linda says I am very bitchy and mean to people on the forum….that she cringes when she reads my posts…sure would have been nice to know THAT before this…she always told me I was great and that she and I were interchangable.
Things sure did run well in the 3 weeks to a month she was gone when she was sick and then moved…I didn’t RUIN SOSEN then.
Linda has finally spoken up about how she feels about me as a COO and that is NOT GOOD!
OK I AM GONE>

Lets and stitches win.

Stitches knew this was going on. She posted in SOA about a coup taking place at sosen and said I would be gone. Probably she was one of our members that Let s pm’d , of course not knowing she was stitches. Way to walk right into AZ’s hands

Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

That is NOT what happened. Ask Static and Topwop. Cheryl is mad because I will not PUBLICLY yell at Lets in the forum. My COO needs to lead by example.

equal justice
SOSEN Staff
Member

Hmmm I have a tape of it Linda, and that is just what happened.
You all decided that we could not tell Lets on the fourm to stop
I compromised to just making a general statement that members were not allowed to send subversive PM’s emails or telephone calles against others.
That was OK for just a hot minute and then that got talked down.
So I said that Billm, Lobster and Static and me have weighed in and said that lets should go… that was unexceptable.
It was all about…Lets tell Lets that he has to stop this, in a pm.
We have been doing that for over a month and it STILL is not working.
you guys talked about needing a policy.
I said we have a policy and I read some of the pertenent parts.
Well, suddenly having a policy that is posted promently in FIRST STOP SOSEN POLICY was not good enough either.
We need to post that policy in National and give lets another chance.
Everyone who knows Lets KNOWS DARN WELL HE HAS READ THE POLICY AND HAS USED THE POLICY IN THE PAST>
After a hour and 45 minutes of being told that everything I suggested was not acceptable and that Lets was going to stay even tho he has been trying to get me kicked out of SOSEN for a month and even Stitches of AZ knew about it Lets stays and Cheryl GOES.
I think that pretty much sums it up.
AS I said I have a tape of the meeting if you think I am not telling the truth.
There was a lot more in that hour and a half.
Like me reading the post Linda says I was personally attacking Lets and Lets was not mentioned in it at all. NOT AT ALL> All I did was make a general statement that subversive pming and emailing should be reported to staff. NO MENTION OF LETS WHATSOEVER…if he took it personally it was because he knows he is guilty of it.

equal justice
SOSEN Staff
Member

SO now you deleted my good by post to the members I have worked with and slaved over for just as long as you have?
That is SO wrong!

this was all it said

It has been my privilege to work for, and with all of you. SOSEN has grown so much in the last year it is incredible. It has become a force to be reckoned with. I have been fighting this battle for 4 years now and I have learned and grown so much in that time. I have accomplished things I could never have done were it not for the grace of God equipping the called, and of course for every one of you.
I think the hardest and most painful battles I have fought were ones that occurred within SOSEN.
I can take what ever the Anti’s throw at me, but I am vulnerable to those I have trusted and called friend.
I have also never been one for self aggrandizement. What I have done, I have attributed to SOSEN. We are a TEAM! SO I will not make this into an “ALL THAT I HAVE DONE FOR SOSEN” speech.
I simply wanted to tell you all that you have been my family and I Love you. Every moment of this battle, every stress and pain has been worth it and more, each time I read an article that tells at least some of the truth, every time someone says “thank God I found SOSEN” every time a reporter or legislator changes his mind on these horrible laws. And especially when someone gets back on their feet or wins their freedom from the lifetime of abuse the Scarlet Letter of Sex Offender has placed on them.
I will NOT be starting a new group or forum. The RSO support and education community does not need another forum. It needs everyone to stand TOGETHER, in NUMBERS too big to ignore! I will, however continue my advocacy. I will continue to fight with every breath I have in me. I will just be doing it on my own now. I would love for you all to know exactly why this has happened, but I cannot do that on the forum. I am sure you will hear much rumor and one sided bologna, but I can only trust those who know me to know that it would take something really big to make me leave SOSEN. Believe me, if there had not been a war waged against me, and it be allowed to continue, I would not be going anywhere. SOSEN has been my life. I will now make a new life. I thought I could remain at SOSEN as just a member, but with the vitriol going on behind the scenes, that chance is looking slimmer and slimmer.
You all take care of yourselves now! Many of you have my email address and for those who do not have my phone number and may want to call contact Billm and he will know who it is safe to give my number to. I don’t have to tell you to stay strong and keep fighting the good fight, because I already know you will.
God Bless you all. I will miss you.

Stitches, you were right, there was a coup going on against me. I laughed at you when you said that, but I guess the last laugh is on me. The thing is, you may have taken MY voice out of sosen, but there are MANY MORE voices there! Mine is not the only voice. In the grand scheme of things, this is only a very, very small victory for you. SOSEN will remain strong and will remain a very large thorn in your side. I DO get the last laugh on that one.

What the hell do you find so threatening about that linda?

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

NO Cheryl YOU said That On of two thing had to happen. Either I pyblicly yell at Lets on the forum or he goes. Sound like an ultimatum to me

equal justice
SOSEN Staff
Member

You have a problem with your short term memory, bet I know why. Thats why I taped it.
I compromised several times and the compromises were not accepted.
EXACTLY what I said happened, happened.
ASK STATIC OR I WILL BE haPPY TO SHARE THE TAPE
and you did not answer why you deltetd my good bye message. There was nothing wrong with it

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

Cheryl Take a deep breath. Sleep on this.. You are STILL TRYING to air dirty linen on the board

equal justice
SOSEN Staff
Member

I tried talking to you and top and static for an hour and 45 minutes.
Nothing I said was good enough.
You all chose lets
END OF STORY

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

Cheryl I am still willing to work things out with you. You do not have to leave. Please stop reacting with pure emotion and take a deep breath. Sleep on this. We love you. You HATE to be told you are wrong.. Something else is happening with you then just this.I am worried about you. You need SOSEN as well as we need you. Cheryl you and I have always worked well together.
Linda

klpsupermom
SOSEN Staff
Member

I am sorry it had to end like this….Cheryl please reconsider and work on this…. sad1 sad5

billm
SOSEN Staff
Member

Just curious, Received a pm that members looking at who’s online shows Cheryl as hidden. Have never seen that before

equal justice
SOSEN Staff
Member

All you have to do is to go into your profile and click the button that you do not wish to show your online status.
For some reason that lists you as hidden.
Who in the world would pm you about that and how would they KNOW it was me?

topwop
SOSEN Staff
Member

topwop@gallatinriver.net

Cheryl,
I am sorry you are gone you will be missed. You have done a great amount of work here and accomplished much.

You never mentioned that you were recording the meeting, and permission was never granted. That is too bad. That also is very unprofessional.

You should play that tape for the people that are interested, it is very revealing. You also need SOSENS permission to do so. You have mine.

Your picture of a battered woman with her mouth taped shut is in appallingly bad taste and needs to be removed immediately. That is also very unprofessional.

Your willingness to reveal and twist what was talked about in a SOSEN Board Meeting also is very unprofessional.

I am tired of your threats to quit if we do not give you your way.
I personally accept your resignation and wish you well. If you ever wish to come back we will deal with you openly and honestly and you will be welcomed.
Best of luck and best wishes.
topwop

equal justice
SOSEN Staff
Member

Yep, I taped it because I knew Linda would not admit what took place there. I have no intention of sharing it with anyone as long as no one lies about what was said. How the heck am I twisting anything when I have the tape of the blasted conversation.
I went directly from the meeting to post this thread and it was PAINFULLY fresh in my mind.
I have not threatened anything, I stated a fact. I compromised over and over and over again and it was never enough.
You all had SEVERAL choices. You asked me what I needed, I told you, I compromised on that time and time again.
In the end, after an hour and 45 minutes when you stated that the posted policies, that Lets has read and commented on multiple times needed to be posted in National and lets given another chance to repent. When YOU KNOW that there is NO way to tell what he is doing in a pm and has stated he will not stop till I am gone.
SO I had a choice either deal with Let’s abuse and total non support of the CEO who said I was mean and nasty in my posts on the forum and she CRINGES when she reads them…I am just mean and nasty and hold grudges…
What other REAL options did I have but to quit? NONE It was not a threat, it was a promise.

AZ/PJ Never got past the front door

2008-09-29T23:09:00.000-07:00

AZ/PJ Never got past the front door

Just a thought
InboxX

Rod Wagner to Linda, Michael, me, Kathleen, Lois

fromRod Wagner <letsgetreal50@gmail.com>
toLinda Pehrson <lindape1ster@gmail.com>,
Michael <book38@cox.net>,
"Bron K.V." <bkvstonegirl98@gmail.com>,
Kathleen Cameron <phd_canadian@yahoo.com>,
Lois Sandy <gospelgal2000@yahoo.com>

dateSat, Jun 14, 2008 at 7:58 AM
subjectJust a thought
mailed-bygmail.com

I wonder if AZ or PJ could have infiltrated staff !!!!! (?????????) realize Cheryl has influence on individuals. BUT, if they could infiltrate. What a better way than to take advantage of the situation in trying to get me banned.

Like I said, Just a thought. But worth considering. I don't have Topwop's current e-mail address. Someone please send him a copy of this.

Rod

Michael to Linda, me, Kathleen, Lois, Rod
show details Jun 14 (8 days ago) Reply

fromMichael <book38@cox.net>
toLinda Pehrson <lindape1ster@gmail.com>,
"Bron K.V." <bkvstonegirl98@gmail.com>,
Kathleen Cameron <phd_canadian@yahoo.com>,
Lois Sandy <gospelgal2000@yahoo.com>,
Rod Wagner <letsgetreal50@gmail.com>

dateSat, Jun 14, 2008 at 10:03 AM
subjectRe: Just a thought
mailed-bycox.net

They did not get behind the curtain. Cheryl is having a bad time in life at the moment. She needs our prayers and some understanding. Staff needs to be as careful as possible not to let anyone in that would be a deterrent to fighting for our cause. This comes from being VERY selective when they let some one in.

You can rest assured that AZ/PJ and the other assholes never got passed the front door.

Mike

The ex coo said “I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I”

2008-09-29T22:53:00.000-07:00

Friday, October 31, 2008

The ex coo said “I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I”

topwop
SOSEN Staff
Member

topwop@gallatinriver.net

THIS FIGHT ENDS TODAY
« on: June 03, 2008, 08:09:29 AM »

SOSEN COMES FIRST OUR MEMBERS COME FIRST THIS FIGHTING STOPS TODAY

Enough is enough.
Linda has NEVER issued Cheryl any ultimatum, neither have I or anyone else. We have all over and over again ASKED Cheryl to simply take some time, compose herself, and stop posting to this insanity.
Cheryl was told at a BOD meeting by Static, Linda, and I that her demands that Lets be publicly flogged was not going to happen, it is unprofessional and not going to happen, when you have a problem with someone you deal with it privately. That is the respect EVERYONE gets in this organization. She then demanded that his account be deleted or she was gone. AGAIN we told her that was not going to happen and WE compromised that we would talk to Lets “AGAIN”, but that was not enough for her so she quit and hung up.

I have stayed neutral on this and have been trying to play peace maker, but no more.

SOSEN COMES FIRST
Our ex coo has put herself, her feelings, her wants, her needs and her desires ahead of everyone and everything WE are trying to do. Reading back through her threads what stands out to me is I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,.

She “claims” Lets and Flower attacked HER? Where are these phantom posts?
I have seen nothing, nothing that I feel is inappropriate. But yet I have talked to lets on two occasions and have had full cooperation from him. Go to his member file and read his last posts……nothing. Cheryl does not like lets and lets does not like Cheryl.
The difference to me comes with the 30 smites she has given him these last several days. We as BOD and you as Staff do not get the luxury of picking sides but must deal with “FACTS”. We all talk about hype and hysteria, emotion vs facts, apply it!!

Fact: Cheryl deleted lets very appropriate posts, called them “garbage”
Fact :Cheryl has backed everyone in a corner with “it’s Let’s or me.
Fact: Every conversation WE have had with her gets twisted around.
Fact: She knowingly secretly recorded our BOD meeting, that’s “ILLEGAL”.
Fact: She refuses to take blame for any of her actions, instead points the blame on anyone and everyone that will not take HER side and stand with her.

No one need take sides against a fellow SOSEN member, something she demands.

We have all been dragged into the middle of this by one person only, as members we do not deserve or expect this, we are volenteers on another more important mission that we need to get back to working toward.

This fight stops today, Cheryl’s has taken her bat, ball, and glove and left on her own only because “WE” will not take sides and give in to her.

I have tried to stop this, so have many others.

Putting Lobster in the position to delete her because once again she knows Linda will not is unfair to him and to her. It only plays on pure emotion.

Give me the authority to do this and I will do what for right now is in SOSENS best interest. I as BOD will accept this unpopular duty. This is why I was elected to BOD by staff, to sometimes make unpopular decisions. SOSEN COMES FIRST!
Cheryl is and will always be welcomed to come back here, but under the terms we all accept not under her mandates and demands.

Cheryl, I will miss you, god bless and come back when you are ready.
topwop

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

AMEN!!!!

lobster1138
SOSEN Staff
Member

she already deleted her own account, the deletion is just waiting for admin approval… once she deleted it, she could not log on anymore…

i’ll go ahead and “approve” the deletion… don’t want to, but i’ll do it…

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

NO let it sit there!

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

too late! I STILL want Cheryl to come back. SHE NEEDS TO STOP FIGHTING WITH THE ANTI’S!! IT IS changing her. She was over there again last night. She needs a couple of days AWAY from the computer.

coolrich001
SOSEN Staff
Member

Cheryl needs the time to regroup. I hope/think she will be back. There is no way we can easily replace her.
Granted, anyone can be replaced. The key is how much pain it causes the organization. That is why I can fight with my boss, ask him what part of his butt he pulled his latest “idea” from and still have a job the next day.

MomOf2
SOSEN Staff
Member

I have had to take some time away from my computer myself. I HAVE a full-time job, and can’t do more than little bits at work. SOSEN is important, very important, but it’s beginning to make my significant other uncomfortable. I had to take some time just to keep peace at home because Cheryl was NOT acting professionally. Thanks for putting everything so clearly and concisely.
I HOPE (with the new rules for staff behavior posted on the sticky) that this will run a bit more calmly. We get enough from outside. We shouldn’t be doing it to ourselves.

Yours for grace and mercy,
Lois

coolrich001
SOSEN Staff
Member

I am on the same sinking ship. I work 50-60 hours per week. That iws why I am not around that much.

“East German Stasi” Part 1- Sosen deletes posts and rips new ones

2008-09-29T20:58:00.000-07:00

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

reported post
« on: January 14, 2008, 08:43:45 AM »
——————————————————————————–

nkrso wrote this in the thread I NEED HELP A gay man is in a domestic violent relationship and asked about housing in Fl I also noticed nK karma is-6

Re: I need help!!!!
« Reply #6 on: Today at 12:12:20 AM »
——————————————————————————–
can you go to that bridge where there are other RSO?

I doubt your partner will follow you there. and that way you won’t be alone.

——————————————————————————–

letsgetreal50
SOSEN Staff
Member
Karma: 16

——————————————————————————–
minus 6 is not good. How this guy ever made it to Roar’s BOD is beyond me. But it does explain one reason why Roar is so ineffective.

I say, delete the post. We cannot recommend “under a bridge!”

Or just raise hell about the post.

Lets
——————————————————————————–

Billm
SOSEN Staff
Member

——————————————————————————–
I thought his comments were in poor taste.
I’m concerned that comments by people like nkrso are being used against SOSEN by people like WASP and AZ.

Posted by ( Stitches77 ) on January 1, 2008 at 2:22 p.m. ( Suggest removal )
It could also be used to counterbalance their acts of civil disobedience. You know, how Sosen said to make hundreds of email accounts and register them so the system is overburdened and can’t function?
Oh, yeah, and how they encourage destroying GPS monitors just to cost the taxpayers more money knowing it will have to be replaced? Why, Kevin Misner was destroying 3 of them a week. He estimated he had already cost the taxpayers over 10,000 just in replaced GPS monitors.
And let’s certainly not forget their plan to use liquid latex on their faces so they can’t be identified. Can’t forget that one.

They are trying to make the comments of one member to appear as policy of SOSEN.

IMO, I think we at least need a disclaimer.

Here is a sample that would need to be modified for our use.

Disclaimer

Views expressed in the articles published in this site are solely those of the authors and do not reflect those of the publisher or the editors of YoursDaily.com.

I have seen some that say do not necessarily reflect

letsgetreal50
SOSEN Staff
Member

——————————————————————————–
I agree with this disclaimer:

Views expressed in the articles published in this site are solely those of the authors and do not necessarily reflect those of the publisher
——————————————————————————–

static
SOSEN Staff
Member

——————————————————————————–
When I saw that post last night, I was in the process of ripping nkrso a new one, but I read it again and I’m not sure he didn’t mean it sincerely, so I waited to see what you all thought of it. I have had my problems with nkrso, but I’m starting to think he’s just dumb. Or at least I hope so- some of his posts in the past have been potentially harmful, and I’ve tried to monitor his posts in order to respond appropriately. I just don’t know if he meant it as a snide comment, or if he actually thought it was good advice. Those of you who know him better- let me know, and I’ll respond accordingly. He seems to back off quickly when I get on him for posting dumb things..

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letsgetreal50
SOSEN Staff
Member

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I think he is either dumb or trying to make sosen look bad.
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static
SOSEN Staff
Member

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I didn’t know he was BOD of another organization. That could explain a lot…

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letsgetreal50
SOSEN Staff
Member

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I questioned Betty of Roar concerning him and she told me he was a BOD member.

I’ll see if I can dig up her e-mail.
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letsgetreal50
SOSEN Staff
Member

——————————————————————————–
Quote from Betty:

“NK was one of the very first people that joined Roar. He is also on our Board of Directors.”

Betty

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static
SOSEN Staff
Member

——————————————————————————–
I see someone already deleted his assinine post, so let’s just keep our eyes on this guy. I’ll verbally bitch-slap him if he keeps getting out of line. For some reason, he doesn’t argue with me much…
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Billm
SOSEN Staff
Member

——————————————————————————–
Quote from: static on January 14, 2008, 11:21:51 AM
I see someone already deleted his assinine post, so let’s just keep our eyes on this guy. I’ll verbally bitch-slap him if he keeps getting out of line. For some reason, he doesn’t argue with me much…

Wouldn’t it be better to remove the post then PM him, politely explaining it was in poor taste and not acceptable in this forum. Do it in a nice way and if he can’t agree with that, it’s time for him to hit the road. We definiely don’t want to respond to him where wasp and az can read it.

letsgetreal50
SOSEN Staff
Member

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Go for it.
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Billm
SOSEN Staff
Member

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I tried, but wasn’t as polite as I would like to be. Sorry

Here is PM I sent him.

Regarding this post by you:

“can you go to that bridge where there are other RSO?

I doubt your partner will follow you there. and that way you won’t be alone”

I’m sure you meant well, but IMO it was in poor taste. It’s very important we think before we post on SOSEN. How would you feel if you were seeking help and received a reply like that. Please be more considerate of others in future comments. Have a great day
Bill

letsgetreal50
SOSEN Staff
Member

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Nothing to be sorry about. Tell it like it is.

Lets
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static
SOSEN Staff
Member

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Quote from: Billm on January 14, 2008, 11:41:59 AM
Wouldn’t it be better to remove the post then PM him, politely explaining it was in poor taste and not acceptable in this forum. Do it in a nice way and if he can’t agree with that, it’s time for him to hit the road. We definiely don’t want to respond to him where wasp and az can read it.

Bill, your a better diplomat than I. I’ve had a few “run-ins” with nkrso, so I’m a little biased. You’re right about the way we should handle this..
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klpsupermom
SOSEN Staff
Member

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Bill,
I thought you handled your response very well and appropriately. No need to be sorry.
Kathy

Sosen isn’t the Gestapo “Put up or shut up”

2008-09-29T19:05:00.000-07:00

static
SOSEN Staff
Member

Anyone else notice this?
« on: Today at 05:58:13 AM »
Reply with quote Modify message Remove message Split Topic

Ok- here we go again… And of course Lets is in it up to his eyebrows. Isn’t this the same Tmax who left in a tizzy the last time we disagreed with his and Lets’ “vision”?

http://forum.sosen.us/index.php?topic=4716.msg24124#msg24124

Author Topic: Better Focus! (Read 29 times)
tmaximus95
Member

Let’s be Activists!

Better Focus!
« on: June 01, 2008, 05:37:53 PM »
________________________________________
I think SOSEN should focus on support and education issues, and become a real therapeutic type of site. It’s just my opinion, but SOSEN is all over the place, and doesn’t appear to focus on personal support. I think that’s where SOSEN’s niche should be. There’s a great number of caring people here, but no one’s getting anything material done. Things with substance that affects us all.

The bottom line is that I think that SOSEN should stay focused on support and education, and let other sites focus in their own areas. There’s so much fragmentation and disenfranchisement going on that it’s a wonder that we could ever get anything solid done about these laws.

Warm Regards.

TMax.

WillySO
SOSEN Staff
Member
________________________________________
Support and education are highly important. I share your views on that. Speaking only for myself, I will say that I get all I need of that from everyone. Being here has been a terrific family experience for me and done me worlds of good. May I suggest you be very specific about what it is you think we are not doing in this area?

What I find myself in disagreement with is your view (if I read you correctly) that the work we are doing to actively influence and change some of these laws is mis-directed. There are highly organized and determined groups out there working to further restrict and punish us for our crimes. To sit idly by and not take an active role in the politics of this issue seems like a big mistake for me.

I think we can, and do, do a great job of both support, education, and active political action. If we seem disorganized and scatered it might be because you don’t see everything that goes on behind the scenes. We are a diverse group with many, often contradictory, opinions. Somehow in spite of that most of us understand that the thing that unites us in this battle is much stronger then those things that sometimes put us at odds with each other.

As the lowest of the low on the publics list of dispised ex-criminals we are all very aware of this culture’s willingness (dare I say eagerness) to judge us as being unfit to live. I can’t speak for anyone else on this, but let me say that having gone thru what I have gone thru tends to make me less likely to judge others. Sure there are some folks here to love to shout and disagree. Sometimes they make unnessary trouble for others. But I am reluctant to judge them cause I am far from perfect myself.

We know that God and our mothers forgive us for what we have done, now the battle continues for the public at large and our legislators in particular. In my opinion support and education are important but far more important is the job of fighting these stupid laws.

If we just lay down and take it, we have given these victims rights groups just the outcome they wanted all along.

I guess I still have fight left in me. Depends on the day really. Today was a good day.

Willy

LetsGetReal

Re: Better Focus!
« Reply #2 on: June 01, 2008, 08:47:26 PM »
________________________________________
Tmax, I know and understand what your saying. However, your post is too short and needs more information.
If I can interject something here. Yes. Sosen is primarily a support and education and hopefully always will be. Support is vital to the individual and family members. Education is also vital. Members tend to educate one another by posting, reading the news as well as scientific fact and empirical data. We comment on the forum, learn from one another on the board.

The forum is certainly a good place to be whether your a lurker or active.

I think what becomes frustrating to those who want to do more is the fact that sosen does not have enough workers who are diverse enough at taking sosen down several paths at one time.

It’s tough enough doing what sosen does with the amount of people that get involved. A handful end up working their butts off, while the majority stay disconnected from coming forward.

That’s always been the case as I comprehend it.

Now, I know where your coming from as I know what is going on. I’m excited about it.

Why not write a letter and submit it to staff. Explain what your allowed to reveal, as I know much is TOP SECRET. and it is in my opinion HUGE to the cause. There are several things happening as we speak.
This I can say, there are now 5 more state sites being built. and four specific sites each dealing with specific issues. And more will come.

I believe what Tmax is saying is that we need to understand one anothers function and purpose and be very supportive of one another. We need to do this by forming a coalition of CEO’s of various web sites and become united like never before.

Sosen is the very best Support and Education network in the world. We, can all in our own right be the best that there is. cfcoklahoma is just getting started as is 5 others. In time, TOGETHER, we will become the strong force that together brings down these unconstitutional laws.

I’ll shut up and wait for Tmax to put his thoughts down and send them to staff.
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http://forum.sosen.us/index.php?topic=3475.msg24122#msg24122
Re: I’m a journalist deeply troubled by SO laws and treatments
« Reply #33 on: June 01, 2008, 05:30:46 PM »
________________________________________
I believe what’s needed is articles showing the positive aspects of former offenders who’ve been successful in the community. I also think the articles should focus on the injustices being perpetrated on kids because of this onslaught of hatred and contempt for the truth.

This battle against sex offenders was won through angry emotionalism, and it will be defeated in like kind. That goes against what most people believe, but for the nice folks that think that being soft when your rights are being stripped from you is the way to go, well please, stay away from me. For anyone that wants to become a REAL ACTIVIST, please contact me here, or through my email.
Anyway, it’s nice to see some journalists with some ethics and integrity on this forum. I wish there were more like you, I think?

TMax.

http://forum.sosen.us/index.php?topic=4715.msg24121#msg24121

Topic: Hi All! I’m TMaximus95 (Read 33 times)
tmaximus95
Member

Hi All! I’m TMaximus95
« on: June 01, 2008, 05:21:00 PM »
________________________________________
I’ve been around for awhile, and have become an activist of sorts since the inception of these sex offender restrictions policies. I’m a leader, and a doer. I need to find a support home, where sex offender support and education is happening within the realms of sex offender recovery. I can be an emotional guy, but I’m too pissed off right now to be emotional

I believe that together, all of us, we can overcome the stupidity incorporated into these sex offender laws. We need to confront our representatives and point out the evil of their ways. We must be nice at first, but then, kick their butts if they don’t listen. I’m ready, are you?

I want to only be associated with activists that believe in material/real accomplishments. I don’t believe that posting gripes on an internet forum is where it’s at. I think the real battle is on the streets, with your neighbors and representatives. It’s better to make a friend through honesty, than it is to make an enemy over complacence.

Let me know if there’s anything I can do to help out with RSO Counseling, advice on relapse prevention, emotional support, and the education for those things. Are you freakin’ kidding me?!

You may want to visit my new site: http://www.rightsandlaw.net for strictly LEGAL topics on civil and human rights issues.Ah yes- the inevitable plug for your own site while downing Sosen. Why didn’t he just put it in his sig, like his buddy Lets did?

Warm Regards,

TMax.
________________________________________

Am I the only one who sees what’s going on in our forum? It was bad enough with Vanguard and F1 constantly insinuating that SOClear is where it’s at- Now I guess Tmax and Lets are in the mix. Personally, I’d be more than happy if they would all go over to SOClear with their claptrap. If we are so ineffective, why do they come here to promote themselves and their latest stupidity?

static
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Anyone else notice this?
« Reply #1 on: Today at 06:07:16 AM »

We’d better figure out what we’re going to do with the SOClear radicals (this includes Lets)- I’m finding it more and more difficult to not use the old “flame thrower”. And once the flaming starts, it ain’t gonna be easy to douse the fire. angryfire

billm
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Anyone else notice this?
« Reply #2 on: Today at 06:12:42 AM »

I see everything that goes on and it’s obvious that Lets is using SOSEN to push his own site.

static
SOSEN Staff
Member

Well, everyone does that. But what’s with all the SOClear people? This has been a quiet little problem for a while now. Lets is just aligning with them to further his own cause. But we’ve lately had a lot of SOClear promotion on the forum. And it’s usually coupled with criticism of Sosen. Ya gotta wonder- if we’re so ineffective and useless, why are they coming here instead of going to the marvelously effective SOClear? Tmax said he wants nothing to do with our brand of activism- so why’s he here? And isn’t it a bit odd how all of this smacks of coordination amongst these people? It would be an interesting exercise to look at who has been PMing more than normal (and with whom).

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member
Karma: 65
DO NOT FEED THE TROLLS

We need to just watch them. They are members and have valid points. This is a small close knit community.

I am not changing SOSENs focus. The “angry SO” is not how SOSEN goes about things.

I think everyone is at edge. We are not the gestopo here. Let folks talk if it is not hurting SOSEN.

coolrich001
SOSEN Staff
Member

My gut reaction is to have TMax, and those like him/her develop their own program and do it under the SOSEN umbrella. If T thinks we need more support, let T be the SOSEN counselor. That is, if T has the credentials, which I doubt.
It is the old, ” put up or shut up” gambit.

static
SOSEN Staff
Member

No. uh-uh. Tmax shouldn’t be offered anything remotely like a leadership position- especially in our Therapy area.

I find it hard to believe that anyone here is unaware of what a few of our members are up to. Tmax’s posts, in particular, are divisive. This has nothing to do with the current controversy around here. I posted about this a while back in a thread titled “SOClear”. Thus far, there has been no action taken. We can sit and watch them some more- but I think we’ll be watching as they put the nail in the coffin of Sosen if we don’t start taking this seriously NOW. How much more “watching” do these people need before we decide to actually moderate the damn forum?

This thread is really just a repost of what I’ve already posted previously about SOClear- I’m doing the responsible thing by posting in Staff and trying to get some action. I’d be lying if I said that I’m not going to take care of this myself if all we can do as a group is drag our feet. Consensus is nice, but it doesn’t facilitate quick response. Margaret Thatcher said that consensus is the absense of leadership. We are the leaders of Sosen- we’d do well to lead ASAP.

There is much more going on in the background than we are admitting. There was a bit of a vacuum left when SoHopeful collapsed. We are the best ones to fill that vacuum. Unfortunately, SOClear is determined to do the same. The difference is that we aren’t sending our members over to SOClear to troll around for new recruits. They are doing this to us. And they are regularly downing Sosen in the process- and posting stuff which will be used against us. And Lets is right there with them, doing the same. Either we quickly come to terms with this, or I will.

No- we aren’t the Gestapo, but we are supposed to be moderating this forum. Otherwise, why do we even have a Staff? I’m doing the responsible thing and discussing this in Staff, instead of giving these idiots a verbal pounding. Meanwhile, they are still on our forum “doing what they do”. I won’t sit on my hands much longer.

So far, the only thing Staff has offered as a solution is to keep watching these idiots destroy us from within- are there any other suggestions? Because at some point, we are going to have to decide whether we are going to moderate this forum, or simply let the inmates run the asylum. At some point, we need to start actually running Sosen the way we see fit. I’m putting this out here so that we can reach a consensus about what to do. But doing something involves action. It’s time to clean house. Or we can “support” ourselves right into oblivion.

Cheryl’s not here- so who’s going to volunteer to be the “heavy” when we need it?

According to every person I’ve talked to, everyone is in agreement that if it came down to a decision between Lets and Cheryl, we’d all choose Cheryl hands down. But so far, Cheryl is the only one on moderation right now. I don’t really care who’s right and wrong- this is unfair. Everyone agrees that Lets started this- so why the hell isn’t he being muzzled like Cheryl is? We may not like Cheryl’s approach sometimes, but is there any doubt about what Lets is doing? And now because we’ve let him sit on our forum garnering his own version of “support”, we’ve got a whole group of people to deal with and Lets is making sure to be right in the thick of it. The situation as it currently stands is unacceptable. And frankly, we’d better do something about it very soon.

Here’s what I propose-

BOD agreed that Lets had only one more chance. He has used up his chances. He has been repeatedly warned by Linda for over a month now, and is obviously determined to continue his assinine behavior. Seeing how BOD agreed that this was his last chance and he was walking on thin ice- it’s time for Lets to go. Before anyone disagrees with me on this, I’d ask you to not only state your disagreement, but give good reason to keep him around- and also offer some other solution. If you can’t do this, then he needs to be shown the door.

Then we need to bring Cheryl back- no strings attached. She owes Linda an apology for some of the things she said, and Linda owes her an apology for punishing her while allowing Lets to do the same things. And that’s where this little controversy ends. Here’s what no one seems willing to say- Yeah, Cheryl posted about Lets in subtle ways in National. But he did it first. And Cheryl was the only one to be held accountable for doing this. To date, Lets has yet to be sanctioned in any way, and he continues to make Sosen all about him. Cheryl has shown no signs of being like Shirley- she just got pissed. The worst that would have happened is that she would’ve continued to argue and be pissed- that doesn’t deserve her being effectively banned from voicing her opinion. If we’re willing to say that Tmax, Lets, Vanguard, Fallenone, etc. have a right to voice their opinions when their opinions are so obviously antiSosen, why is it ok to muzzle Cheryl. What no one wants to admit is that when it comes to Lets, Cheryl was right. There’s no shame in admitting this and fixing the situation. Then, after we’ve dealt with the real threats to Sosen, we can all yell at Cheryl. It’s really dumb to deal with Cheryl as some sort of threat, yet let these idiots continue to actually BE threats. The truth is that if we didn’t have this current distraction, we’d be dealing with these important things. It’s time to hit the “reset button”, forgive and forget, and start taking care of SOSEN.

We can sit and argue about Cheryl all day long and get nowhere. Meanwhile we have members who are disrupting our forum and we are doing nothing but “watching”. If we’re all in agreement about Lets and his cronies, why are they still here? If we get rid of Lets, it’ll send a message to the other disruptors, give us the moral standing to be able to moderate appropriately, and it will also make it possible for Cheryl and Linda to drop this argument. The truth is that even if our CEO and COO weren’t fighting, we’d still better start moderating our forum or it’s going to get out of hand quickly. But when you consider that this would also help to end this stupid argument, it’s really a no-brainer. And any members who would choose to follow Lets out the door are probably better offf with him than here being “rabble-rousers”. I suspect that most of them would come back to us pretty quickly anyway. And it doesn’t really matter if we were to lose half our membership- our job is to run Sosen, not allow every malcontent to destroy us from within. This is simple- he needs to go, and so does anyone else who wants to come here to be disruptive. There really shouldn’t be any disagreement about this. If we need to have a formal vote on this, fine. But let’s “get ‘er done” and quit pussy-footing around the issue.

Can ya tell I’m sick of this? laughing7

billm
SOSEN Staff
Member

I’m very aware of it. I ran a music sharing hub with over 300 members and always about 70 people from all over the world connected at any time. Always had to look out for the Let’s and Tmax’s trying to take over. Unfortunately for them, the server was running on this computer.

static
SOSEN Staff
Member

This is the PM exchange I had with Lets over his “Karma” thread. And here’s the thread- http://forum.sosen.us/index.php?topic=4734.0

Keep in mind that Lets told me about his little “Karma war” about a week and a half ago. Which means this thread was intentionally misleading and disruptive. Am I out of line? Also notice that I didn’t delete anything- I simply locked the thread before Lets turned it into another one of his rants.

——————————————————————————–
Quote from: LetsGetReal on Today at 07:12:51 PM
Static, do you have a problem with me? If so, let me know. But for sure don’t pass my communications to you on to others without my permission to do so.

Lets

Lets- There has been a lot of things going on in the background that I wasn’t aware of. Now we basically have a crisis in Staff. I’m irritable and sick of arguments and distractions. I apologize for bringing up our phone conversation, but that thread is just silly. And it disrupts our members who didn’t really care about Karma points before. You can’t post a complaint about this forum being abused if you are abusing it too. Or at least not without expecting a response. You know as well as I do that this thing with Cheryl has gone too far. I’m not picking a side- other than being on the side of SOSEN. This thing between you and Cheryl has been a major disruption and I’m putting a stop to it. That’s my job- I don’t care who’s right or wrong or who started it, this has gotten out of hand and is hurting SOSEN. I’m not taking a side, but I am going to respond to needless arguments on this forum. You were dishonest about what you were doing with Karma points- and basically sayng that it’s a flaw with SOSEN. No it’s not. It’s a flaw with the people who choose to abuse the Karma system. Since you participated in it just as much as whoever smited you, you have no reason to blame it on SOSEN or our forum.

static
SOSEN Staff
Member
Ooohhh…. SNAP!

Just received this from Lets and Flowergirl. Odd how they seem to always respond at the same time, huh? I’m only posting this stuff so that my actions will be known by all. I’ve seen what Lets is capable of and it’s best to keep everything above-board when dealing with him.

Re: (No subject)
« Sent to: static on: Today at 07:50:56 PM »
——————————————————————————–
Thanks for the PM. Lets bashing isn’t going to solve a friggin thing. I want you to know that I have absolutely no personal animosity toward Cheryl. NONE.

What we spoke about on the phone was between you and me. I honored that and I expect you to also. Yes I did smite her but I put it back as karma. Yes others were smiting her and there is nothing I could do about that.

Our discussion concerning Cheryl was private and I related to you why I, Flower and Book38 resigned from staff. I would think that Cheryl’s outrageous behavior would cause you to think about what we talked about. It only confirms in my mind what I shared with you. THAT was to go no further.

You have not been in staff to know enough concerning what we went through with Shirley and other situations.

Cheryl did help build sosen into what it is today, SO DID I! I play a very significant role in getting sosen on it’s feet.and so did many others. Linda, Lee Lee, Flowergirl, Book38, etc. You came in after the dust settled.

When I came to the old sosen yahoo group there was only about 150 members. Sosen was several years old and going know where. Today, a year later there are 400 and growing.

I would like to see Cheryl back, doing what she does, not reacting to what she thought was going on.

It makes me wonder who was feeding her misinformation to make her go off like she did. I hope to God you were not running around telling tails out of school. Someone was feeding her bits and peices and for some reason she thought she had a whole picture.

That’s all I can figure was someone was being a lacky for her. She sure as hell didn’t get it from me. She has everything so twisted that it makes no sense to me whatsoever.

Again, I HAVE NO PERSONAL ANIMOSITY against Cheryl. She does have a control problem If that weren’t true than Flower surly wouldn’t have lefe and neither would have Book38.

Now, with that out of the way. I still want to meet you when you come to Tulsa. I do want the disk you promised. I’m hoping there is alot of information I can use.

I think we’re screwed now with the Ohio decision. I too am on sosen’s side and do not want to see any harm come to it. In fact, I’m looking forward to seeing sosen be the very best “SUPPORT” site ever. I am doing things that will assist in that and for sosen to also be the BEST EDUCATIONAL Network on the web. It is and it will be better.

I hope Cheryl does come back and presses ahead with issues that matters to all of us

I need a beer.

Rod

(No subject)
« Sent to: static on: Today at 07:53:55 PM »
——————————————————————————–
Don’t mean to be a busy body but all of that Karma and Lets stuff should have been handled in a PM … just my opinion but when I read it I felt like I was snooping in someone’s personal email. I’m telling Let’s the same thing … not taking sides! this is one of my pet peeves … I hate coming to a professional/private forum and reading harsh/personal exchanges.

Well, yes- it should’ve been handled in a PM, but Lets decided to post about it and subtly act like it’s a SOSEN problem when it’s really just a Lets problem. I really have a great deal of respect for Flowergirl, so I’m a little disappointed that she is participating in Lets’ games so much.

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member
*
Karma: 66
[applaud] [smite]
Posts: 943
DO NOT FEED THE TROLLS

Static You are new to forums. There are ways of handling things that just ESCALTE things or calms them. You my dear are ESCALATING things. The time spent verbal jousting with LEts could have been put on a letter to Cheryl that you said you would write in last nights staff meeting! Now because of that Cheryl is going to delete her membership at 9 pm

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

There is something in the works from a few RSO agencys that would make us more powerful as a whole. I just found this out today. Bear with me. I was asked to keep it private until it is a sure thing. I KNOW that SOSEN will want to be included in it.

static
SOSEN Staff
Member
Ooohhh…. SNAP!

Quote from: lindape54 on June 02, 2008, 09:23:44 PM

There is something in the works from a few RSO agencys that would make us more powerful as a whole. I just found this out today. Bear with me. I was asked to keep it private until it is a sure thing. I KNOW that SOSEN will want to be included in it.

Ok- first off, I didn’t escalate. I did my damned job as a moderator. And I reproted back to staff on my every action. Wow- what an out of control idiot I am! And whatever is “in the works” has not a thing to do with the problem Lets is. And btw- we already tried the RSO counsel thing- am I the only one who sees that joining forces with all the other groups is half of what causes our problems?

You asked me to become a staffmember. You asked me to join BOD. In fact, you were the one who brought me into this stupid fight betwen you and Cheryl. I’m neither a hot-head, nor a reactionary. But I saw it with Webstuff (and was right) and I see it with Lets (and I’m right about him too). I was told that a big part of my responsibilities here is to moderate the forum. So far, every time I do, it’s called “escalation”. No offense, Linda, but if I’m so out of control, that really reflects badly on your judgment, because you asked me to be here. “Your way” isn’t working. If you’re going to second-guess everything your moderators do, then there’s really no need to have moderators in the first place. I suppose Bill, Chris, Cheryl, me, and Gospelgal are all out of control wackos… Because we all see what you are turning a blind eye toward. At some point, you’re going to have to consider the fact that you are human and very well may be wrong. This isn’t an attack- I know how much this situation has taken its toll on you. But you don’t seem to recognize that you are basically tying our hands, then expecting us to build the house of SOSEN. It’s time to re-evaluate, Linda.

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

Why are we bothering with meetings? Static PERSONAL attacks do not belong on the forum. Fine you guys think you can run this place? I QUIT

static
SOSEN Staff
Member

I didn’t attack Lets at all. What I say about him here has no bearing on how I dealt with him on that thread. He started a thread that was not factual, argumentative, and silly. I responded appropriately with several good, truthful replies. When it became personal, I didn’t respond, I locked the thread. None of that is an attack- it is called moderating the forum.

Everyone here knows what Lets was doing with his stupid smiting games- I’ve told you about our phone conversation and his PM’s basically admit to it. So that thread was nothing but a lie and an insinuation that Sosen has somehow dropped the ball, when it was really Lets’ stupid smite war that caused the problem. I responded appropriately, and in fact exercised way more restraint than I should’ve. that is not in any way an attack. It was good moderation.

This stays in staff

2008-09-27T22:22:00.000-07:00

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

This stays in staff
« on: Today at 10:20:22 AM »

New Personal Message: It's me NOP_Christine

Linda,

Hi, Linda. It's me, NOP_Christine, but I wanted you to know that I'm here - and if you need, you can share that with people you KNOW here. Not all of even the SOhopeful members know this as one of my alternate names, so if it could be kept between you and I and a couple of Board members, as necessary, I would be grateful. I want to be sure that the SOhopeful folks land relatively softly. That is my actual purpose for being here at this time. When I originally signed up here, I was considering already leaving SOh for other reasons, which will become clear down a couple of paragraphs from here.

We didn't refer people here because PetraLuna/AZ and their ilk have targeted ROAR and SOSEN next (and apparently Cheryl specifically), and I couldn't refer our folks to somewhere that they would be coming under immediate attack, particularly in view of tsand/bcu/John J's impersonation of Zman in the comments section of that one news item out of NW Florida (not to mention his obvious release of information to the reporter). You should know that eAdvocate thinks that SOSEN released the info on the problems within SOhopeful to the press, but we of the BOD did not believe that, and I think everyone involved with both organizations saw the flame war that occurred in the comments section of that article as of last night. Tsand/bcu/John J or whatever his name is in any given moment is choosing to pick on one of our more reactive members over at SexOffenderAlliance's forum, but I doubt that will continue for very long. Metanoid is a good admin and I'm sure that he will make the offensive individual aware of the proper protocols and take any other necessary action to quell any flaming.

The arrested former Exec Dir of SOhopeful had everything of SOhopeful's attached to himself - sole signatory on bank account, sole incorporator in the end, etc. Ultimately, shutting down the forum and the front page (and the corporation to the extent possible) were the only ways to prevent any potentially illegal activity from continuing behind the scenes, including the very real possibility of questionable donations through the paypal page. Carolyn had resigned (I don't know if you got a chance to see that - her family is in desperate need of her attention), and the remaining women (and ultimately theparson too) didn't believe it to be appropriate, especially in the current situation, to have another registrant in the Executive Director spot. Not like we could have done anything anyway, with the corporation tied so tightly and exclusively to Freeman and none of us having any access to any of it.

Freeman had unlimited access to the architecture of our forum, as the Exec. While I know most of the former offenders who are working hard for reform do not have ill intent, what I have learned is that it really is nearly impossible to know which former offenders are going back into a life of crime and which ones won't. The arrested individual had apparently been living a double life for a long time, and none of us had even an inkling. When I resigned in January, it was over a falling out with him over his lack of willingness to be accountable about the lack of phone number and address (address being necessary in order to receive bank statements and bills). My original resignation to him had cited my need to focus on my education, but my abrupt premature departure was the result of his vitriolic attacks on me for trying to get him to answer questions that had just been ignored for many months (including Cheryl's questions about when we would get our 501(c)3 status - which never materialized).

We also don't know if he was using the behind the scenes of the forum for nefarious purposes. The potential for that likely problem to continue in some form or other had to be shut off as well. There were hundreds of user names whose accounts had not been activated, and it certainly appears that Freeman may have been having people sign up for SOhopeful just so that he would have an email address for him. We have no way of knowing for sure - he was supposed to activate accounts and put people into user groups.

I am trusting that you see that most of this information really does have to be kept fairly close to the vest. I have tried to explain to people who have emailed me as much as I can without causing any undue panic.

I think the most painful part of all of this is that the AZ/PJ people were right about one thing - active offenders were/are insinuating themselves into groups where sincere people do have child safety at their core message, and using us for cover. I don't think any of the groups are immune, and I don't know what anyone would do about that. None of the groups have real good screening processes (criminal background checks and the like) for leadership positions. (Freeman apparently had a far more extensive criminal history than just his one sex conviction - much of it violent in nature.) The one thing I know I won't ever do again is be in a leadership position of any organization where a registrant is at the top of the food chain, as unfortunate as that is as it regards registrants who really are working at living rightly and legally. And, for the next few years, I have to focus all my attention on my education so that I can create a treatment program that actually works for folks like our family members, whose victims were family members and where reconciliation is both desired and capable of being done safely.

I hope that explains what's happening. I know that's a lot of inside stuff, but I felt like you, as the head of SOSEN, deserved to know as much of the details as I can give you.

Blessings,
Christine (now a_woman_apart)

Margie Slagle tried to help the situation - Sosen silenced her

2008-09-26T22:28:00.000-07:00

URGENT MESSAGE PLEASE READ

mslagle
Member

URGENT MESSAGE PLEASE READ
RE: Tom Madison
« on: Today at 09:04:24 AM »

Dear SOSEN Members,

As an attorney, one who works diligently both day and night, on appeals for sex offenders in the state of Ohio, I feel compelled to share my feelings on Tom Madison’s performance on the Morning Show with Mike and Juliet on August 18th. After reading the “Bravo Tom” comments in the Mike and Juliet Show thread, I am changing “compelled” to “urgent”.

Tom Madison does NOT represent you. Tom Madison doesn’t even understand what it is like to BE you. He doesn’t now, nor has he ever had to live under the same type of obtrusive laws and restrictions that you and your families face every single day. If you go to the Oregon State Sex Offender Registry and put Tom Madison’s name in the search engine, you will not find him. He is not on the Internet, nor is he subject to community notification. In short, his life has not been affected all that much by his sex offender conviction. He has never been asked to leave his home, or told that he cannot attend functions at his child’s school, or take his children to the swimming pool or park. Tom Madison has no clue what it’s like to be on the registry and all that that entails, yet he succeeded in discrediting the one man who could have raised awareness and helped all of my clients and yourselves by making real changes.

What Tom Madison did on that television program was set me, my clients, and folks like yourself BACK, he did nothing to help the cause. He single-handedly negated all of the hard work we have done to attempt to eliminate these laws. Even worse, he decimated the credibility of the former legislator who accepted sex offenders in his home because of his heartfelt beliefs. Tom Madison completely discredited what Tom Armstrong has done because he became angry, unrepentant, and combative. His ego was definitely showing, once again, just as it did back in December in Ohio, the only difference this time is he definitely kicked it up a few notches.

What he DID do was appear proud to be a sex offender. Tom proclaims to the world in every way he can, including business cards that have “sex offender” written on them, that he IS a sex offender and by all accounts from yesterdays demonstration, an unrepentant one. None of my clients, nor most of the registered sex offenders I have met, are proud of the behavior that landed them on the registry. I know many who were not guilty, but even THAT does not make them proud.

Tom Madison hurts the very people he purports to represent. He needs to check his mouth at the door and stop attempting to speak publically on your behalf. If he doesn’t, the positive changes you all want so badly to come about, will never be realized.

The “angry, pissed off sex offender” persona does nothing but harm, because the general public doesn’t CARE that you are pissed off and angry and they never will, as a matter of fact they ENJOY having the knowledge that you ARE angry and miserable. You will not get the results you are looking for with performances like I saw out of Tom Monday morning.

You will know you are successful, that you have made inroads in the battle against these laws when you hear, “Wow, you’ve really given me a lot to think about here, maybe these laws AREN’T working, maybe they ARE doing more harm than good”, out of people who just said to you “I think you should live in the middle of the desert.” You won’t get that by being angry, yelling, or trying to bully the person into seeing things your way. Which is exactly what Tom tried to do.

If you truly care about this cause, and you want these changes to occur, you need to let Tom Madison know that he does NOT speak for you, and that if he can’t speak without having a tantrum, you’d just as soon he shut up.

I love the work that I do. I put more hours into it than there are in a day often times, but I keep going because I see, with my own eyes, every single day what it’s like to have to abide by these restrictive laws. I cannot sit back, while silently watching someone who is supposed to be HELPING you, actually destroy your hopes and dreams of a better future in this country. Every time this man opens his mouth to speak publically, he knocks us back and negates progress that we cannot, that YOU cannot afford to lose. Every minute amount of progress we make is hard fought for, and I’m tired of seeing MY clients, and folks like you hurt by a man who’s ego is the size of Mt. Everest.

What did Tom Madison show the American Public Monday morning?……No,…… he did NOT show them that registered sex offenders are mad as Hell and they aren’t going to take it anymore. He showed them that they are hot tempered, in denial, unrepentant, and VOLATILE, therefore people to be feared. That’s ALL he showed them!!

We cannot afford this. We need to work together to intelligently and calmly educate the misinformed. Not yell at them and point a finger in their faces while telling them they are.

I have every faith that Linda and Jackie will do the right thing by severing all ties with this man and his organization. If they don’t, he will bring SOSEN down with him, and that would be a terrible sight to see.

We can win this battle if we stay strong and true to the cause. I’m with you, and behind you. Never give up.

Sincerely,

Margie Slagle, Attorney
Ohio Juctice and Policy Center

Kinsella
Member

Re: URGENT MESSAGE PLEASE READ RE: Tom Madison
« Reply #1 on: Today at 09:21:10 AM »

Margie I agree with you 100%. Tom lost any chance of having a positive impact for us the second he raised his voice. I don’t know him personally and have never met him, but it does seem like he is proud of his status as a sex offender and if that is true then he does not truly understand what we are going through. I hate to criticize anyone who is fighting for us, but I felt the same way you did after watching that segment. I felt like his anger just confirmed a lot of peoples misconceptions about sex offenders.

LetsGetReal
Member

Re: URGENT MESSAGE PLEASE READ RE: Tom Madison
« Reply #2 on: Today at 09:21:12 AM »

After reviewing the two video clips and conferring with others, I agree with Margie Slagle. I missed several statements due to my anger with FOX. That interview has done a vast amount of damage to all of us.

LetsGetReal
Member

Re: Fox News Mike and Julie show this morning (Monday)
« Reply #33 on: Today at 09:36:46 AM »

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After, viewing both videos and conferring with others, I am disassoicating myself and cfcoklahoma from SoClear and Tom Madison.

He does NOT represent ME or the cause.

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It is NOT “them” Cheryl, it is you

2008-09-26T21:36:00.000-07:00

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

CHERYL Come back and talk
« on: May 29, 2008, 04:08:16 PM »
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CheryL
I reinstated your staff privilidges. Get back here and calm down and talk.
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equal justice

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Linda,
Ihave been talking all morning and it has done me no good.
All it has done was to show me that I can have SOSENS your YOUR back, but when it comes to me, I am out in the cold.
I have talked and talked until I am blue in the face over all this crap.

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A message has been sent from the forum.sosen.us Contact Staff form:
===============================================
Thursday, May 29, 2008 - 03:34:35 PM EDT

Sender name: Lets
Sender email: letsgetreal50@gmail.com
===============================================

Subject: SOSEN Contact Staff - Other_Subject

First of all, I never attacked Cheryl. Never.Well we all know that is a bold faced lie. When I resigner from
staff, I explained in my resignation why. Cheryl deleted that so staff
members wouldn’t see it. Cheryl deleted it because she was sick and tired of looking at lets untruths and attempts at Slander
Cheryl has NOT been under attack by me. It’s all in her imagination.That’s a cop out if I ever heard one.
She certainly has some “control” issues that needs to be dealt with. WHO HAS CONTROL ISSUES! I had some control because I was the COO and it was my fricken JOB to have some control. If Lets can’t control he has temper tantrums

I missed three (3) staff meetings, NOT months. And I missed them due to
a medical problem for which I am now taking medication for. He has not attended a staff meeting since the ok symposium went bust. The “medical problem” was depression and it looks like the medication did NOT do the trick.

If anyone has had a temper tantrum it has been Cheryl. What Cheryl Had was the straw that broke the cammels backStalking my
posts, deleting posts and entire threads for what?? I have been staying far away from Lets and his posts until today. For just this reason so that I would have a defence when he accused me, and I KNEW that was comming. Beats the hell out of
me.

Sosen is an open forum and as long as one is not bashing someone or
another advocacy group, then members are allowed to post their thoughts,
wishes desires, dreams, agree and disagree. That’s the way it’s been and
that’s the way it should be.There are many ways to bash someone and to destroy their credibility. That is just what Lets and Flower girl have been doing. They have been playing games, just like the games he started playing with his beloved “kudos”. You can disagree without rancor. Lets has been unable to do that. It is his way or else. The old “I KNOW I’M right posts

This entire post of hers is just plain nuts.The only thing that is nuts is that this has been allowed to go on.

I’m not a psychologist but I think the whole problem is that

Flowergirl, Book38 and I resigned because of Cheryl’s controlling ways.I will agree that Flower Girl left staff because she was mad at me. I had the NERVE to make a post in staff, directed at EVERYONE, not just FG that asked people to make edits on articles in a timly manner because things were getting held up. SHe had posted that an article was good and then came back 8 days later with a major correction. It was not directed at her, it was a general request. She got mad and quit. She denied that was why she quit, but it was pretty obvious Books quitting had absoulutly NOTHING to do with me. NOTHING! Lets resigned because he was enraged that he was not asked to be on the BOD. The only thing that had to do with me was that I happened to be the one who made the post about static being secretaryIt’s a
huge problem. And she NEVER forgot why we resigned.You bet I didn’t, why would I forget, it had nothing to do with me. It just have festered
into what you now see. What has festered into what you see now is LETS refusal to let his anger go and his driving need to put me in what HE SEES as my place.

I could go into the rest of her post but I don’t need to defend myself
anainst this maddness.He cannot defend his manipulative behavior. The man has a serious problem and I will no longer be his and his pal flower girls whipping boy.

LetsGetREAL

equal justice

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Well I am going to bed and to sleep.
Obviously you all declined the teleconferenc that TOP wanted to have. Why am I not surprised.
Linda, I hope you are well satisfied with yourself. I have been betrayed plenty of times before in my life, but I think this is one of the worst. I would NEVER have believed you capable of this.
All I asked for was a few words from you, just a few words, God what a fool I have been.

equal justice

Big favor after you locked me out of the forum altogether and took away my admin privileges. I had those admin priveledges before you even knew this forum existed. Now I understand why SOSEN could not get rid of its bad name…it was still run by someone who thought nothing of stabbing her friend and coworker in the back. Someone who takes and takes and takes but could not give back a few words in return.

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

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Cheryl, YOU resigned and deleted your staff position. I took away your admin privililages because you are so mad you are not thinking straight. I have TRIED to talk to you all day I DID talk to FG and Lets, jUST NOT ON THE OPEN FORUM. I know FG told you that.

Cheryl, I LOVE YOU. How you were acting today was total blown out of propersion and escalted by YOU. Just because we are staff does not mean it is right to post personal attacks on the forum.

I am sorry Cheryl but YOU are the one that is wrong. Go back and read the shit YOU WROTE

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klpsupermom
SOSEN Staff
Member

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I don’t know all of the details, but I do know we need both of you to keep this organization going strong!!!! We have been making progress; as I have seen in the latests posts in National. Please work through this. WE NEED YOU!!!!!!!!!

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

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I WANT to work things out with Cheryl. I am hoping that after a good nights sleep we can talk. Over at SOA Cheryl and Static battled with PJ/AZ. That by itself was enough stress.

Cheryl and I have 2 different styles. I won’t fight with PJ/AZ because I refuse to give them ammunition to put on my page.
You guys all know me. I HAVE Cheryls back. I have nothing but the upmost admiration and respect for Cheryl.
Those PJ FREAKS can creep you out when you are their target. I was a basket case for a while when they first started with me.

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klpsupermom
SOSEN Staff
Member

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I surely hope so. You guys are the backbone of this organization. It has grown by leaps and bounds! We don’t need to take any steps backward!!! I am glad I am not razzling with them over there. I have enough to deal with!!!

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

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I hope so to Kathy. What good is Batman without Robin, Laural without Hardy, Starsky without hutch??
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bronkv
SOSEN Staff
Member

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I think everyone just needs to calm down. I’ve always thought of everyone here is an extended family, we all have each others backs and are all working together.

equal justice

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Well I THOUGHT I knew you, it turns out I did not. The reason you kicked me out of the forum yesterday is simply because you kept deleting my resignation post and I kept putting it back. Thats it, thats all.
YOU left Lets and Flower girls garbage on the fourm and REFUSED to tell them to stop. REFUSED! I begged and Begged. You refused.
The only reason I engaged Stitches at SOA was because they attacked SOSEN and YOU. You also know that. You were also there.
Thing is, Stitches would have chewed you up and spit you out. She couldnt do that to me. As usual, I was left to do the dirty work.
Sure, I could have let it stand that SOSEN is run by a CEO that wants to get rid of the age of consent so that pedophile could have sex with childen. I could have left it go on an RSO site that SOSEN supports NAMBLA. But I STAND UP FOR PEOPLE I CARE ABOUT~
You thanked me for being the only one to stand up for you. But you could not put down just a few freaking words in my defense. NOT EVEN 2 damed sentences.
I posted in a topic caled CONVERSATION VS CONFRONTATION
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Confrontation and an “I am right and you are wrong” attitude does nothing constructive what so ever.
We get enough grief in our daily lives from society and the Anti’s that we do NOT need to subject each other to it on SOSEN.

I have seen what has happened to other forums when harsh words and playing games are tolerated. The forum closes.
This will NOT happen to SOSEN. If we have a member who is identified as causing frequent problems and is found to be game playing they will be given a chance to rehabilitate, and if it continues, they will be shown the door.
We are NOT into censorship here at SOSEN. I think we have all seen how open this forum is. For the sake of the entire forum and each member we cannot allow miscreants to cause disruption.
There have been many threads discussing the intention of SOSEN to try to clean out the spies from this forum.
One of the ways you can help us is if you have gotten or do get pm’s from any member that is slandering SOSEN or members of SOSEN, please use the contact staff button and let us know. This is VERY destructive behavior and has far reaching effects.
No one is doing this forum good by trying to stir up trouble behind the scenes. I am not talking about the occasional pm just complaining about “did you see what so and so said!”. I think you can understand what I am talking about.
If you think something subversive is going on, please let us know.
We must not let the Anti’s or anyone else succeed in causing us to get side tracked from our mission or break up the family that is SOSEN
That seems pretty reasonable to me. It is in the context of the thread. It is in context of the threads posted about the anti’s in the forum. It is also in context of Rod emailing and PM ing people with his distorted delusional crap about me which we ALL know is going on. I did this WITHOUT mentioning any person or quoting any garbage that had been said.
THEN
after Flower girl had already stirred up trouble in a thread created about Lets leaving SOSEN she responds with

agree completely with you EJ. But in any organization, people will gripe about how things are being run and about who’s running it. You can’t have an organization in which 100% of the people are happy about the way things are being run. It is VERY important for members to observe and act on their right to openly and honestly voice their opinions about the direction of SOSEN and they should be able to do this without being labeled a trouble-maker or running the risk of having their posts/threads (or memberships) deleted. This is where she makes what she is doing extremely obvious. She is still harping on Lets thread that Linda deleted and the fact that her escalation of the thread created to post the lies Lets was telling behind the scenesThis is, IMO, is REALLY important. Griping is not always an effort to undermine or “take down” SOSEN and shouldn’t always be interpreted as such. This is Flower girl using a technique of distorting what I had said. I made it pretty clear what kind of pm ing I was talking about. I made a point of saying I was not talking about the usual griping. For Gods sake we had just created a contact staff and suggestion area. This is twisting my words and being argumentative and accusatory. I did NOT say what she said I did. SOSEN’s work is so incredibly important and the work of staff is appreciated!!!! You’re all doing a WONDERFUL job and I personally say “THANKS”!!!! Then she sugar coats what she said above with this tripe. I am sorry but this does not work for me. You can’t pop me in the face and then say ” you look so great with that black eye” That tactic is too easy to see thru

Re: Confrontation vs. conversation
« Reply #12 on: May 29, 2008, 10:31:06 AM » Reply with quote Modify Remove Split Topic
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Quote from: flowergirl_1970 on May 29, 2008, 09:57:37 AM
I agree completely with you EJ. But in any organization, people will gripe about how things are being run and about who’s running it. You can’t have an organization in which 100% of the people are happy about the way things are being run. It is VERY important for members to observe and act on their right to openly and honeslty voice their opinions about the direction of SOSEN and they should be able to do this without being labeled a trouble-maker or running the risk of having their posts/threads (or memberships) deleted. This is, IMO, is REALLY important. Griping is not always an effort to undermine or “take down” SOSEN and shouldn’t always be interpreted as such. SOSEN’s work is so incredibly important and the work of staff is appreciated!!!! You’re all doing a WONDERFUL job and I personally say “THANKS”!!!!

You are so right FG. I think I made it pretty clear in my post what kind of destructive stuff I am talking about. We have always been able to and have been encouraged to voice our opinions and needs at SOSEN. Usually when something is asked for, it is quickly provided. And of course, FG knows this but she is too busy trying to put words into my mouth to consider it before she posted
No one is applying any labels here, but we cannot have a free for all. That is all I am talking about…again, I think I made that pretty clear in my post. Each and every one of our members is valued.
I would have to write a book or two to list all the things that I am NOT referring to. That is why I listed only the things that I WAS referring to and I have great faith in our membership to know the difference.Again, something FG knows darn well but this fact had to be ignored so she could harass me Any questions they might have can easily be addressed in a pm or the staff contact button.My asking her to take this crap OFF the forum. We have bent over backwards for member input such as putting in the suggestion box and the staff contact button. Our member are and will always be our main concern. The good of the many will always be weighed against the gripes of the few when decisions are made.
We have staff and we have a BOD. NO ONE HAS A VOTE that outweighs anyone else’s. We all answer to each other, as it should be

Her reply which is just plain STUPID

So then am I to assume that before posts or threads are deleted, the decision will come from staff or BOD and not one member of staff?
Oh yea sure. SHe was in the yahoo forums. She knows how a forum works and the fact that we have moderators.

Quote from: equal justice on May 29, 2008, 10:31:06 AM

We have staff and we have a BOD. NO ONE HAS A VOTE that outweighs anyone else’s. We all answer to each other, as it should be

By this time, I have called Linda and discussed my concern that Lets was let back into the forum after sending a long and angry staff contact letter with an “in your face” attitude, letting us know that he was going to do this HIS way and he was NOT apologizing for his previous bad behavior. I asked her to put a stop to Flower Girl’s twisting my words. FG is Let’s pal and she was harassing me on his behalf.
Then I replied to FG “can I assume” post

Flower girl,
I will be most happy to address any issue you personally have with me via pm. Please feel free to pm me.
We have moderators on this board as all forums do. We trust our staff members judgment and if we see a problem where someone is deleting willy nilly, it will be addressed post haste.
We cannot bog down this large forum with having to have a MAJOR discussion on every move. We would have analysis paralysis if that were to be the case and it does not make even a little bit of sense. Considering the amount of posting that goes on, the need to delete a post is VERY rare. If a post is deleted,very often we will notify that person and explain. Not always, but often.
If someone has a problem with a post being deleted, just punch up the staff contact button and let us all know, THEN it can be discussed and the problem addressed by the entire staff. Now THAT would make sense.
Linda and I are so busy that we often meet ourselves coming and going. We often spend upwards of 12 or more hours on the computer doing SOSEN stuff and trying to fit in our advocacy work. Again, sometimes the greater good must win out.
I do not know how much more SOSEN staff and BOD members can do to meet the needs of all of our members and let each member be heard. If you have suggestions please feel free to use the suggestion box or contact staff button, and of course, there are always pm’s.

When a member has a problem, that problem is addressed WITH that member. They may not like our answer, but we cannot satisfy everyone all the time.
Again I think the post was very appropriate and measured considering I was INFURIATED that this was being allowed to go on.
I DID also say in this post that if Flower girl had a bug up her butt regarding me I would be happy to talk to her about it OFF THE BOARDS
Well Dear Flower, who is allowed to in her very cute and subtle way make me sound like I am Hitler reincarnated, got offended that I DARED to say she may have had a bug up her butt and DEMANDED that I “censor” that statement. See Flower was so condeming of ANY consorship on the forum but FOR HER censorship of me was OK. And, of course, Linda did that for her. Linda took out that and altered my message.
THEN Lets has to get into the act himself

Re: Confrontation vs. conversation
« Reply #16 on: May 29, 2008, 11:51:19 AM »

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I don’t believe anyone loves sosen more than me. Perhaps as much, but not more. My desires are for sosen and the cause that we fight for. That includes other groups and organizations who are active in their own right.
SoClear, for example has matured over the past year and are becoming a force to be reckoned with. They are educating and moving forward. That’s exciting.
State sites are IMO are vital to the national scene. Two more state sites are in the works as we speak. Things do take time and we are all becoming a force that will have an impact on this countries draconian laws Lets has been asked over and over and it has been explained to him over and over that breaking up SOSEN into State sites is NOT productive, yet he continues, cuz, you know, he is gonna do what he is gonna do!
I believe the vast majority of members know and understand that. I’ve worked hard over the past year. Dedicated to the bone and there is no question about my loyalty, dedication and desires. No question. RAH RAH RAH hurt yourself patting yourself on the back there? NO ONE HAD SAID ANY DIFFERENT!
I would NEVER intentionally bring harm to sosen. NEVER.Again no one had said he would

Unless a person is bashing an individual or another advocate organization, there should be no censorship or deleting posts and threads.

Members have an open forum and should never be afraid to express themselves, their ideas, thoughts, hopes and dreams.How in the world am I making people afraid to express their thought and dreams. For God’s sakes I have asked, begged, cajoled for that. Lets here, king of the delete button..is saying this stuff. AND I WAS NOT THE ONE WHO DELETED HIS THREAD! NO ONE IS AFRAID TO SAY ANYTHING AT SOSEN, unless they read Rods thread which pretty much tells them that Cheryl, or should I say Stalen or Hitler reborn is such a bad guy that they need to be afraid.

The very idea that one should not suggest anything unless they are ready to impliment the idea goes against everything sosen stands for. Ideas are the heart of where we came from and where we’re going. Then here he tells the reading audience that I go against everything SOSEN stands for…not bashing.. Hmmm A long long time ago Lets was on one of his RANT in National demanding this and that and the other thing. I posted that if people are going to DEMAND SOSEN does all these things then they should be ready to back up those demands with action of their own. It was not directed at Lets. It was a genreral statement. Lets decided to read into my words then and say that I had said that noone could post hopes and desires and what ever else he was ranting about unless they were ready to do it themselves. NOt only had I not said that, but I made it VERY clear. Linda herself has said repeatedly that Lets was nuts and he was totally wrong in what he was saying. But here he brings out his twisting my words and saying something I did not say.

Freedom to express ourselves is vital to the very survival of this cause. Again with the big bad Cheryl telling people they can not express themselves. What a load of BALOGNA!
He was addressing ME because he MISQUOTED MY WORDS and HE PUT A QUOTE OF MY POST IN HIS POST! THat leaves no question who he was slamming.

Quote from: equal justice on May 29, 2008, 09:37:31 AM
Confrontation and an “I am right and you are wrong” attitude does nothing constructive what so ever.
We get enough grief in our daily lives from society and the Anti’s that we do NOT need to subject each other to it on SOSEN.

I have seen what has happened to other forums when harsh words and playing games are tolerated. The forum closes.
This will NOT happen to SOSEN. If we have a member who is identified as causing frequent problems and is found to be game playing they will be given a chance to rehabilitate, and if it continues, they will be shown the door.
We are NOT into censorship here at SOSEN. I think we have all seen how open this forum is. For the sake of the entire forum and each member we cannot allow miscreants to cause disruption.
There have been many threads discussing the intention of SOSEN to try to clean out the spies from this forum.
One of the ways you can help us is if you have gotten or do get pm’s from any member that is slandering SOSEN or members of SOSEN, please use the contact staff button and let us know. This is VERY destructive behavior and has far reaching effects.
No one is doing this forum good by trying to stir up trouble behind the scenes. I am not talking about the occasional pm just complaining about “did you see what so and so said!”. I think you can understand what I am talking about.
If you think something subversive is going on, please let us know.
We must not let the Anti’s or anyone else succeed in causing us to get side tracked from our mission or break up the family that is SOSEN

Flower girl, after I have asked her repeatedly to take this to a pm or staff contact goes on to say

I’m questioning a procedure, not you!!!! And I think there should be a more solidified procedure in place than, what you’ve outlined below. This is the place for us to speak our voice and it might not always be positive, but this is a forum for expressing opinions … for those who otherwise wouldn’t have a voice at all. Sometimes that voice includes offering constructive feedback to staff, that should be ok!!! I think its an important issue and I’d really like staff to come up with some procedures. I just CAN”T imagine there are so many cases where a post has to be monitored or deleted that it would take up too much of staff’s time to discuss the situation and how to proceed. Or am I wrong and does staff delete a lot of posts? Those issues had already been addressed. Anyone who has been on this forum the length of time fg has KNOWS DAMN well that that is exactly how this forum is run. My God again, I have often defended peoples rights to their own opionion. What in the hell have I worked night and day for? What have I said over and over again? What have I put my marriage in jeopardy for over and over because of the time I spend on SOSEN, especially in our fairly frequent crises! For God’s sake, again, I created this blasted forum. I don’t go around singing my own praises and making mention of every thing I do because that is not who I am. Unlike Rod I would never have mentioned on the forum or in staff how often I have given Linda money when she was in crisis.
I will not sit here and list the hard work and advances I am responsible for.. I prefer to say SOSEN has done this or that, not I have done this or that. But what I did expect was for Linda to stand up for me.
Our last conversation on the phone, I had explained to her that this crap from FG and Lets was the straw that broke the cammels back. I was not blowing it out of proportion but that I had had ENOUGH! I just could not, for my own mental health, fight the many RSO battles and be maligned on my own freaking forum. THat I could not function as a leader in this orginization being attacked from within and it had gone on LONG ENOUGH. ALL you guys did not see all the garbage that Lets was spreading about me…Stuff that was mean and vile and untrue…but Linda kept sending it to me so I knew it was going on. ALso, Lets was so crazed in sending Pm’s out about me that he started accidently sending them to the wrong person and I was made aware of it. I don’t ask for recognition, but I do think I have earned a bit of respect. Linda SWORE on the phone that she was going to make a post right now!!! Putting an end to this crap.
SO this is what she posted.

Quote from: flowergirl_1970 on May 29, 2008, 12:01:08 PM
I’m questioning a procedure, not you!!!! And I think there should be a more solidified procedure in place than, what you’ve outlined below. This is the place for us to speak our voice and it might not always be positive, but this is a forum for expressing opinions … for those who otherwise wouldn’t have a voice at all. Sometimes that voice includes offering constructive feedback to staff, that should be ok!!! I think its an important issue and I’d really like staff to come up with some procedures. I just CAN”T imagine there are so many cases where a post has to be monitored or deleted that it would take up too much of staff’s time to discuss the situation and how to proceed. Or am I wrong and does staff delete a lot of posts?

Staff hardly ever deletes posts. We do have moles in here. And sometimes things are taken off the boards that PJ/AZ will take off and twist around. There are folks on this board that are targets of AZ and we have to keep that in mind. I will bring up this topic at our next staff meeting.
Linda

Oh boy, I just can’t begin to tell you how very defended and vindicated I felt. WOOOOO WEEEEEEEE So after all my begging her to just tell Lets and Flower that they were reading stuff into what I posted and I had not said those things and to stop doing that, the above post was her response.
ANd of course FG’s response to Lindas post was

GREAT! I think that’s a really good idea. I understand the AZ/PJ issue totally!!

Quote from: lindape54 on May 29, 2008, 12:07:57 PM
Staff hardly ever deletes posts. We do have moles in here. And sometimes things are taken off the boards that PJ/AZ will take off and twist around. There are folks on this board that are targets of AZ and we have to keep that in mind. I will bring up this topic at our next staff meeting.
Linda
I said the same things and I was promoting censorship and destroying SOSEN’s mission and telling people they could not voice their feelings.
Linda says it and it is GREAT!

I was sick and tired of being harrassed by Lets and Flower and had requested Linda handle it. SHe had been telling Lets for some time to stop it, and he ignored her. SO I asked for just a few public sentences. I was not asking that they have to leave sosen, just leave me alone! Linda refused and I was forced to BEG her to do it.
SHe still refused. I had told her that if she refused to have my back in this that I was going to have to quit as COO and Staff ….that I had to protect my own mental health and could not be effective.
It did not matter, Linda was not going to budge or offer me a kernel of support.
You would have to know me and the work I have done and the support I have given Linda to know what a betrayal this was.
I was in shock. I could not believe it. Someone who had given so much and had asked for so little and it was denied.
That is really pathetic. I cried all day yesterday. I thought I had gotten past allowing myself to be used by people and I find out that I have been used and tossed away so very easly. The hurt I feel in incredible.
Linda has deleted posts she started here in staff complaining about lets. She deleted my resignation post in National where I finally decided to tell it like it is. I figured if it was OK for Lets and FG that It was ok for me. SHe censored my post to FG and took out “if you have a bug up your butt about something I have said or done”. She took away my ability to post alltogether, then just took away the admin priveledges I had since I created this forum. Linda, who swears she does not know how to do things on the fourm, suddenly knew the intricate in’s and out’s pretty dam well. What was the purpose of making people think you did not know how to do that stuff.
I did not quit because I was making mountians out of molehills. But if you are taking hit after hit after hit, there comes a time when you say ENOUGH! Yesterday was that day. Then when I was completly betrayed by Linda, it was all over.
She can make it sound like it was nothing but she knows damed well it was. THERE HAS NEVER BEEN A TIME THAT I HAVE NOT BACKED HER UP. I backed her up when LETS was tearing her apart over the OK symposium and over how much he had helped her, she was calling me and asking for my help. I did. But she could not offer a couple of sentences on the forum saying I did NOT say what FG was reading into my post and that I DID NOT SAY what Lets said I did. Oh she can call Lets a loose cannon and other stuff, but when it came to backing up her COO, she chickened out. SHe says she was acting PROFESSIONAL..bullshit, she was doing her typical NOT ACTING!
Why do you think I get all the hard ass jobs, because linda WON’T do them and SOMEONE has to sometimes. It is the JOB of the CEO to back up management, not to hang them out to dry. She loves to throw around that she is the CEO. “THe CEO says” THe CEO did”
“Your CEO did this and that”. “THe buck stops here.” Well it just depends on what that BUCK is and who it is.
WE set up SOSEN so that no one person controls the orginization simply BECAUSE of past experience with the CEO getting power crazy.
There is no “The BUCK STOPS HERE”. EVeryone on BOD has ONE VOTE.
I do not recall Quitting the BOD yesterday, yet Linda was really quick to take away my Adm priviledges…Priveledges,by the way, that I GAVE HER!
What happended yesterday could have been over very quickly. It was allowed to escalate by our CEO! It was compounded by a complete betrayal by our CEO! What I asked for was very little. It was refused.

Now how about showing some restraint and NOT deleting THIS post.

billm

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-http://forum.sosen.us/index.php?topic=2825.0

Let’s attack on staff when his Oklahoma rally fell through.

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

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Bill, This is OLD and it was in staff. I am talking about what Cheryl was posting ON THE BOARDS. I told Lets in PM and on the phone to stay away from Cheryl, PERIOD. I also talked to FG. I just did not put it on the boards because IT WAS NOT APPROPIATE.

I am more that willing to have a conference call and settle this

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equal justice

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The only thing I posted on the boards that you could consider not appropriate was my resignation from staff and COO.
You chose to allow fg and Lets posting crap that I was SUPPOSED to be saying that I DID NOT SAY>>> making me sound like HITLER or something, GREAT FODDER FOR AZ,, THAT was OK.
I WAS BEING MALIGNED ON THE FREAKING FORUM>
WHat is so hard about just saying Lets and flower you know Cheryl did not say that, now this has to end here.
That is NO BIG F ING DEAL! That is the LEAST I should be able to expect.
You have been telling lets to cool down and leave me alone for a month now and he has ignored you.
He made a fool out of every staff member with his staff comment when he came back in here.
He makes a statement EVERY TIME he posts with that stupid NAME of his.
YEA Topwop wanted to have a conference yesterday with you, bill, flower girl and lets to work this out, and I agreed, but it did not happen did it.
Bill is just simply pointing out that Lets has been on a rampage UNCHECKED for a long time now. It goes to prove that this is long term behavoir of HIS and I am sick and damn tired of it.
You have been allowing Lets to manipulate you for a while now because he strokes your ego and tells you how wonderful you are.
Same with Flower girl. Come on Linda, you have got to be SOSEN’s sweetheart and will do anything not to tarnish that image, even throwing your COO under the bus.

equal justice

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Just one small example of ME having Lindas back when Lets was attacking HER>
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Is it postponed or canceled? At the staff call there was talk of just postponing it

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equal justice
SOSEN Staff
Member

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Since Lets is the creator and chairman of the symposium, I guess it is up to him

Report to moderator 76.1.178.141

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equal justice
SOSEN Staff
Member

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OK now Lets, I know you worked hard, and I know you are dissapointed, but we are NOT going to start pointing fingers on the public forum. IT AINT GONNA HAPPEN> You can point all you want back here or in pms but NOT NOT NOT on the forum
OK ?

Report to moderator 76.1.178.141
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lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

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Rod
You are going TOOO far on the forum. You are blaming everybody but yourself. YOU dropped the ball in many ways. You ignored Jackie’s instructions YOU didn’t contact the people she suggested for the committee heads You didn’t follow through on my suggestions You were told from the begining that this was YOUR project Those comments were inappropiate in the forum
Linda

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Letsgetreal

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Well, I didn’t drop the ball. I let it be known more that once that “I was as green as a spring apple, and never did this before. NEVER. I followed Jackie’s instructions I contacted the committee. they were all set up on the Ohio Symposium forum but they for the most part never showed up. Some NEVER some one time. Very few ever posted anything. Didn’t ask questions. Except Fallenone. And Flower helped with the letter to Sarah’s Boss. Oh yes, you mailed it and made a few calls. Lets see. Cheryl, the MC never had any input. No, I didn’t drop the ball, I was promised that the committee that put the Ohio Rally together would be there to assist in every way but they dropped the ball. Not me.

Oh yes, I did get side tracked when you were evicted and I spent about two weeks on the board and writing PM’s to get you out of there and up to Ohio, Jackie S was responsible for getting up the half from the ministry but who do you think motivated everyone to give? If I dropped the ball, it was on account of the emergency we had with your situation. I do not have a problem with that. I would do it again to help you but all my efforts for the symposium were pretty much that MY efforts along with MY money to go to OK City. I secured the Venue. I was on site everyday while everyone stayed away. The committee, those with the experience and know how dropped the ball.

Please Linda, don’t tell me I dropped the ball. Hell, I was the only one carrying it.

Your reply on the open form should have been the private response. What you did was put the blame on me, then tell me that I can’t reply on open form. That isn’t right. Your comments are inappropriate in the forum because now your passing the blame to me and I won’t accept the blame for when others have not lifted a finger to help.

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

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I did not make ANY comment on the forum I am not the only one that thinks that part of the blame falls on your shoulders. Being green has nothing to do with you contacting Tammie ,etc and getting them to commit. You are blaming Sarah, Sosen, Etc.

You kept telling people to get busy BUT did not give them any structure. You didn’t follow through with quite a few things a leader must do. Did you contact Stop it now OK? The CDC/ The OK health Dept. Did you PERSONALLY call every committee head that Jackie suggested? You wanted us to do it for you. You PUT people off with your whining. I am not trying to hurt your feelings. I love and appreciate you. But there is enough blame to go around.

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Letsgetreal

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Well, no matter how you look at it, I carried the fuckin ball up to the end. I asked for HELP. You didn’t help. You mailed a letter and made a few phone calls. That’s it! But you never once came to ME and asked what you could do to hepl. I really didn’t expect it from you because of the terrible situation you were in. But Now Cheryl, joined the Forum, she was to MC the entire thing. Here is how many times she visited, ZERO. Jacquie H ZERO visits. Linda Tauer was to head fund raising and told me what ahe wanted to do, I saud fine lets do it. That’s the LAST I heard from her. Margie Slagel was to contact the Ohio PD office. She NEVER answered my e-mail/ How the FUCK can you pass the ball around when your the only one in the game. I resent any insinuation that I dropped the ball. I cried HELP more than once and was totally ignored by everyone.

Static’s post the other day was more right than wrong. I didn’t comment on it because I just wanted this to go away, but when staff says that its MY FAULT, that they supported me, thats total bull-shit. I got only lip service from sosen staff at best.

And that’s ths God awful truth. Don’t you dare tell me I dropped the ball. Staff dropped the ball and so did the committee. I asked for help and NOTHING happened.

So, let me get this straight, if a state has under a certain number of SO’s they get put at the bottom of the list??? Well, 8000 should bring those in Oklahoma up a notch or two but probably not enough to count for anything.

It would have been real nice if one of you would have stopped by the OK symposium and made a few suggestions. I was and still alone on this issue. How the hell am I to give people structure when I, myself didn’t have any?? Green means I didn’t know shit from shinola. But I did call out for HELP!!!!! No One came to help.

Letsgetreal
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Least I forget, when I called the second teleconference, Fallenone and I were the ONLY one’s there. No One else.

“You PUT people off with your whining.” Now that’s one hell of a thank-you note for the “can do, letsgit er done, Ain’t nutin to it but to do it,” Guy.

I’ve given a few hundred dollars that I didn’t have when requested. Let’s see. Oh yes, just prior to your eviction, your Internet was cut off. Who paid that? OMG, Let’s did.

Talk about whining, If you call asking for help, whining, then you must have been whining pretty much when you were in a fix (Sick, evicted and penniless. BUT, I respond to pleas for help. when I yell for help, Its called whining. That is a very cruel thing to say to me at this time. Very cruel.

I even paid for the postage for the HRW Report and donated an additional $20.00 to sosen and never did get the report.

I feel very disenfranchised right now. Nothing I have done means shit unless sosen and its staff is directly benifited. That’s very sad

equal justice
SOSEN Staff
Member

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Lets,
Please lets not get into a pissing match over this.
I remember VERY clearly when you called me when you FIRST had the thought of doing a rally. I TOLD you that it could not be a SOSEN staff project. I TOLD you there was a HELL of a lot of work on something like this. That we all had far too much to do to carry it off. I made it ABUNTANTLY clear that if you wanted an OK rally YOU were going to have to do it.
Shit happens and we do not have the luxury of PLANNING when it happens.
MY mom dying took up almost a month of my extra time. When Linda was in the hospital and then moving, I had the entire responsibility of SOSEN. Then there was the fact that Linda was in the hospital and then moved.
NOW we have this Jim Freeman crap going on and it is NOT the time for SOSEN’s NAME to be in the media and flying around the anti’s sites regarding this symposium.
Any person who we advertised was going to speak would be ripped to SHREDS by the anti’s and it would be publicised that they were in league with a bunch of pedophile lovers and people like Jim Freeman.
I am not BLAMING you for anything. I did not see anyone on the forum BLAMING but what YOU started.
We all love you darlin, but this just did not work out. I, for one, NEVER PROMISED you anything!!!!!!
And I did post something at least once in the ok site and you and I talked on the phone multiple times….maybe not during your teleconferences…there is only so many times I can stay up late and take that time on the phone at a scheduled time.
My husband gets pissed that I spend so much time with SOSEN already.

The FL legislature is meeting now and has some seriously bad legislation planned. I have been working on one of our Senators for 2 years now and THIS MAY be the year I can help to make a difference for over 35,000 RSO’s in FL.
Doing this blaming is very destructive. It needs to stop

Report to moderator 76.1.178.141
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Letsgetreal
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This is the end of this conversation. Except for one last thing. You are very mistaken about posting at the OK site. I would check through admin. “members” and check who and when ever visited. It always said NEVER when referring to you.

The fact remains that the committee that had joined the forum to put this thing together never responded to the second teleconference call. Only Fallenone did. This certainly is not something one person can do by themselves. Unless they have a lot of cash. It takes dedicated individuals of whom I believed were sent to me by Jacki S.

I guess because this being, not in their back yard, had much to do with it.

I don’t forget broken promises because I always keep my promises. Let’s see if I ever come to help them in their state when they ask. FUCK THEM. That’s just how I feel. Broken promises and total desertion without the respect to at least e-mail me and tell me they are too busy or as in this case, don’t care.

Lets stated in his rant to staff upon getting back in the fourm yesterday that he had missed only 3 Teleconferences.
Well this thread and rant from Lets was from March 11th and he had already stopped attending the teleconferences by then.
Just more lies and manipulation. Since when do we let a disgrunteled member run SOSEN? OH yea, since he is being oh so nice to Linda NOW, and is bashing Cheryl.

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

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Cheryl

ROD WAS WRONG. I told him that. I just did not say it on the boards. Cheryl you ARE contributing to the escalation of things, I am not the only staff member that thinks that.

I DID NOT throw my COO under the bus. You were being just as nasty and cattie ON THE OPEN FORUM as they were. Think about it. Reread the things you wrote. Oh I forgot I deleted that whole thread. Here it is See who STARTED the shit. Cheryl You have been deleting posts of Lets and Flower that just plan piss you off. This has been brewing for a while. PLEASE except my apology if I hurt your feelings. That breaks my heart. I love you But I thought all 3 of you guys were wrong PERIOD
Topic: Confrontation vs. conversation (Read 145 times)

transitions
Member

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We are all here for different reasons, and have many different points of view. During a forum setting there tends to be some issues with how a person interprets what someone has posted. I am guilty of this myself. Words on a page can not express an emotion or the intent of the person reading the post. One of the biggest issues is not understanding if a poster is attempting to engage in conversation or if their post was a confrontation. I was curious about learning how to better address a subject so it would offer the reader a clearer perspective of what the intent of the post is. Any ideas?

Report to moderator 24.26.65.137 (?)

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flower girl_1970
Member

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Use emoticons!!!!!!!! For example:
A. I think you are wrong and completely disagree with you
vs

B. I think you are wrong and completely disagree with you

The person reading “B” might not be as offended or get on the defensive with happy emoticons vs how one might respond to “A” (does this example work at all?!? ).

Report to moderator 74.71.222.53 (?)

equal justice
SOSEN Staff
Member

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Exactly Flower!
That is why we have so many emoticons on SOSEN.
They can put in to a message what reading black words takes out.
I try to use them often.
A wink or the dripping sarcasm tells one immediately what’s up.
I love emoticons, not just because they are cute but because they fill a need.
Another thing you can do, is if you think someone is being harsh or misunderstanding you, send that person a pm instead of escalating on the boards.
That’s not our first impulse. The first impulse is a nasty reply on the boards. We can, however, control our impulses, at least most of the time

Report to moderator 64.15.157.51 (?)

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transitions
Member

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I will take emotion 101 later today. For know I need to ; and fix me.

This entire thing hit a little to close to my heart

Report to moderator 24.26.65.137 (?)
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transitions
Member

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Thanks for the phone call equal, I am feeling much better. You are a good friend!

Report to moderator 24.26.65.137 (?)
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equal justice
SOSEN Staff
Member

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You too Trans… ((((group hug))))

gotta love those emoticons!

Report to moderator 76.2.100.41 (?)

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fallen one
Member

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There will always be times someone posts something out that makes me want to but we have to remember that everyone has their own ideas about how things should be, but as long as they don’t resort to FU Pedo, then there is hope for a sharing of ideas.

Report to moderator 65.27.235.172 (?)

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tiggeronmv

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Everything we already know, we know.

We only can learn more from others.

I like this forum a lot. You are all becoming my second family. Yes, even in families we have disagreements, but we are held together by love. Here, we must remember that we are held together by purpose, and yes some love too.

Has something happened to Lets? There was a comment yesterday or the day before that some of Let’s posts had been deleted, and I haven’t seen any more postings since.

We count on staff keeping this forum orderly and we don’t need to know all the details of staff decisions. But, we don”t want to lose contributing members, so when a problem comes up, and they will, staff should privately contact the member and work things out in a way that brings unity.

In His service,
Tiggeronmv

Report to moderator 76.19.19.9 (?)
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LetsGetReal-I DO WHAT I DO

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That’s why I love you so much Flower. Common sense.

Quote from: transitions on May 27, 2008, 11:44:33 AM
I will take emotion 101 later today. For know I need to ; and fix me.

This entire thing hit a little to close to my heart

Report to moderator 70.142.55.245 (?)

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equal justice
SOSEN Staff
Member

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Confrontation and an “I am right and you are wrong” attitude does nothing constructive what so ever.
We get enough grief in our daily lives from society and the Anti’s that we do NOT need to subject each other to it on SOSEN.

I have seen what has happened to other forums when harsh words and playing games are tolerated. The forum closes.
This will NOT happen to SOSEN. If we have a member who is identified as causing frequent problems and is found to be game playing they will be given a chance to rehabilitate, and if it continues, they will be shown the door.
We are NOT into censorship here at SOSEN. I think we have all seen how open this forum is. For the sake of the entire forum and each member we cannot allow miscreants to cause disruption.
There have been many threads discussing the intention of SOSEN to try to clean out the spies from this forum.
One of the ways you can help us is if you have gotten or do get Pm’s from any member that is slandering SOSEN or members of SOSEN, please use the contact staff button and let us know. This is VERY destructive behavior and has far reaching effects.
No one is doing this forum good by trying to stir up trouble behind the scenes. I am not talking about the occasional pm just complaining about “did you see what so and so said!”. I think you can understand what I am talking about.
If you think something subversive is going on, please let us know.
We must not let the Anti’s or anyone else succeed in causing us to get side tracked from our mission or break up the family that is SOSEN

Report to moderator 76.2.100.41 (?)
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flower girl_1970
Member
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I agree completely with you EJ. But in any organization, people will gripe about how things are being run and about who’s running it. You can’t have an organization in which 100% of the people are happy about the way things are being run. It is VERY important for members to observe and act on their right to openly and honestly voice their opinions about the direction of SOSEN and they should be able to do this without being labeled a trouble-maker or running the risk of having their posts/threads (or memberships) deleted. This is, IMO, is REALLY important. Griping is not always an effort to undermine or “take down” SOSEN and shouldn’t always be interpreted as such. Sosin’s work is so incredibly important and the work of staff is appreciated!!!! You’re all doing a WONDERFUL job and I personally say “THANKS”!!!!

Quote from: equal justice on May 29, 2008, 09:37:31 AM

Confrontation and an “I am right and you are wrong” attitude does nothing constructive what so ever.
We get enough grief in our daily lives from society and the Anti’s that we do NOT need to subject each other to it on SOSEN.I have seen what has happened to other forums when harsh words and playing games are tolerated. The forum closes.
This will NOT happen to SOSEN. If we have a member who is identified as causing frequent problems and is found to be game playing they will be given a chance to rehabilitate, and if it continues, they will be shown the door.
We are NOT into censorship here at SOSEN. I think we have all seen how open this forum is. For the sake of the entire forum and each member we cannot allow miscreants to cause disruption.
There have been many threads discussing the intention of SOSEN to try to clean out the spies from this forum.
One of the ways you can help us is if you have gotten or do get Pm’s from any member that is slandering SOSEN or members of SOSEN, please use the contact staff button and let us know. This is VERY destructive behavior and has far reaching effects.
No one is doing this forum good by trying to stir up trouble behind the scenes. I am not talking about the occasional pm just complaining about “did you see what so and so said!”. I think you can understand what I am talking about.
If you think something subversive is going on, please let us know.
We must not let the Anti’s or anyone else succeed in causing us to get side tracked from our mission or break up the family that is SOSEN

Report to moderator 74.71.222.53 (?)

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

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Quote from: flower girl_1970 on May 29, 2008, 09:57:37 AM
I agree completely with you EJ. But in any organization, people will gripe about how things are being run and about who’s running it. You can’t have an organization in which 100% of the people are happy about the way things are being run. It is VERY important for members to observe and act on their right to openly and honestly voice their opinions about the direction of SOSEN and they should be able to do this without being labeled a trouble-maker or running the risk of having their posts/threads (or memberships) deleted. This is, IMO, is REALLY important. Griping is not always an effort to undermine or “take down” SOSEN and shouldn’t always be interpreted as such. Sosin’s work is so incredibly important and the work of staff is appreciated!!!! You’re all doing a WONDERFUL job and I personally say “THANKS”!!!!

Well said FG and EJ! That is why we put the contact staff button on top. I WANT AND NEED to know what my members think and want. As the CEO the buck stops with me. I REALLY REALLY try as hard as I can to make SOSEN “THE” place for support, help, education and advocacy.
We want your ideas and visons.I see many. many great things happening in the future. Last night for instance, SOSEN was on a conference call with other RSO agencies putting together a 800 hot line number. It should be up and running in a month!!!

Report to moderator 12.208.0.215 (?)

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equal justice
SOSEN Staff
Member

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Quote from: flower girl_1970 on May 29, 2008, 09:57:37 AM
I agree completely with you EJ. But in any organization, people will gripe about how things are being run and about who’s running it. You can’t have an organization in which 100% of the people are happy about the way things are being run. It is VERY important for members to observe and act on their right to openly and honestly voice their opinions about the direction of SOSEN and they should be able to do this without being labeled a trouble-maker or running the risk of having their posts/threads (or memberships) deleted. This is, IMO, is REALLY important. Griping is not always an effort to undermine or “take down” SOSEN and shouldn’t always be interpreted as such. Sosin’s work is so incredibly important and the work of staff is appreciated!!!! You’re all doing a WONDERFUL job and I personally say “THANKS”!!!!

You are so right FG. I think I made it pretty clear in my post what kind of destructive stuff I am talking about. We have always been able to and have been encouraged to voice our opinions and needs at SOSEN. Usually when something is asked for, it is quickly provided.
No one is applying any labels here, but we cannot have a free for all. That is all I am talking about…again, I think I made that pretty clear in my post. Each and every one of our members is valued.
I would have to write a book or two to list all the things that I am NOT referring to. That is why I listed only the things that I WAS referring to and I have great faith in our membership to know the difference. Any questions they might have can easily be addressed in a pm or the staff contact button. We have bent over backwards for member input such as putting in the suggestion box and the staff contact button. Our member are and will always be our main concern. The good of the many will always be weighed against the gripes of the few when decisions are made.
We have staff and we have a BOD. NO ONE HAS A VOTE that outweighs anyone Else’s. We all answer to each other, as it should be

Report to moderator 76.2.100.41 (?)

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flower girl_1970
Member

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So then am I to assume that before posts or threads are deleted, the decision will come from staff or BOD and not one member of staff?

Quote from: equal justice on May 29, 2008, 10:31:06 AM

We have staff and we have a BOD. NO ONE HAS A VOTE that outweighs anyone Else’s. We all answer to each other, as it should be

Report to moderator 74.71.222.53 (?)

LetsGetReal-I DO WHAT I DO

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That 800 number is great news. I know you have a lot of experience with hot line support. Being able to refer to food banks, agency’s and many other groups will certainly be a huge asset

Quote from: lindape54 on May 29, 2008, 10:10:03 AM
Well said FG and EJ! That is why we put the contact staff button on top. I WANT AND NEED to know what my members think and want. As the CEO the buck stops with me. I REALLY REALLY try as hard as I can to make SOSEN “THE” place for support, help, education and advocacy.
We want your ideas and visons.I see many. many great things happening in the future. Last night for instance, SOSEN was on a conference call with other RSO agencies putting together a 800 hot line number. It should be up and running in a month!!!

Report to moderator 70.142.55.245 (?)

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equal justice
SOSEN Staff
Member

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Flower girl,
I will be most happy to address any issue you personally have with me via pm. Please feel free to pm me.
We have moderators on this board as all forums do. We trust our staff members judgment and if we see a problem where someone is deleting willy nilly, it will be addressed post haste.
We cannot bog down this large forum with having to have a MAJOR discussion on every move. We would have analysis paralysis if that were to be the case and it does not make even a little bit of sense. Considering the amount of posting that goes on, the need to delete a post is VERY rare. If a post is deleted,very often we will notify that person and explain. Not always, but often.
If someone has a problem with a post being deleted, just punch up the staff contact button and let us all know, THEN it can be discussed and the problem addressed by the entire staff. Now THAT would make sense.
Linda and I are so busy that we often meet ourselves coming and going. We often spend upwards of 12 or more hours on the computer doing SOSEN stuff and trying to fit in our advocacy work. Again, sometimes the greater good must win out.
I do not know how much more SOSEN staff and BOD members can do to meet the needs of all of our members and let each member be heard. If you have suggestions please feel free to use the suggestion box or contact staff button, and of course, there are always pm’s.

When a member has a problem, that problem is addressed WITH that member. They may not like our answer, but we cannot satisfy everyone all the time.

« Last Edit: Today at 08:28:38 AM by equal justice » Report to moderator 76.2.100.41 (?)

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LetsGetReal-I DO WHAT I DO
Member

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I don’t believe anyone loves sosen more than me. Perhaps as much, but not more. My desires are for sosen and the cause that we fight for. That includes other groups and organizations who are active in their own right.
SoClear, for example has matured over the past year and are becoming a force to be reckoned with. They are educating and moving forward. That’s exciting.
State sites are IMO are vital to the national scene. Two more state sites are in the works as we speak. Things do take time and we are all becoming a force that will have an impact on this countries draconian laws
I believe the vast majority of members know and understand that. I’ve worked hard over the past year. Dedicated to the bone and there is no question about my loyalty, dedication and desires. No question.
I would NEVER intentionally bring harm to sosen. NEVER.

Unless a person is bashing an individual or another advocate organization, there should be no censorship or deleting posts and threads.

Members have an open forum and should never be afraid to express themselves, their ideas, thoughts, hopes and dreams.

The very idea that one should not suggest anything unless they are ready to impliment the idea goes against everything sosen stands for. Ideas are the heart of where we came from and where we’re going.

Freedom to express ourselves is vital to the very survival of this cause.

Quote from: equal justice on May 29, 2008, 09:37:31 AM
Confrontation and an “I am right and you are wrong” attitude does nothing constructive what so ever.
We get enough grief in our daily lives from society and the Anti’s that we do NOT need to subject each other to it on SOSEN.

I have seen what has happened to other forums when harsh words and playing games are tolerated. The forum closes.
This will NOT happen to SOSEN. If we have a member who is identified as causing frequent problems and is found to be game playing they will be given a chance to rehabilitate, and if it continues, they will be shown the door.
We are NOT into censorship here at SOSEN. I think we have all seen how open this forum is. For the sake of the entire forum and each member we cannot allow miscreants to cause disruption.
There have been many threads discussing the intention of SOSEN to try to clean out the spies from this forum.
One of the ways you can help us is if you have gotten or do get pm’s from any member that is slandering SOSEN or members of SOSEN, please use the contact staff button and let us know. This is VERY destructive behavior and has far reaching effects.
No one is doing this forum good by trying to stir up trouble behind the scenes. I am not talking about the occasional pm just complaining about “did you see what so and so said!”. I think you can understand what I am talking about.
If you think something subversive is going on, please let us know.
We must not let the Anti’s or anyone else succeed in causing us to get side tracked from our mission or break up the family that is SOSEN

Report to moderator 70.142.55.245 (?)

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flowergirl_1970
Member

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I’m questioning a procedure, not you!!!! And I think there should be a more solidified procedure in place than, what you’ve outlined below. This is the place for us to speak our voice and it might not always be positive, but this is a forum for expressing opinions … for those who otherwise wouldn’t have a voice at all. Sometimes that voice includes offering constructive feedback to staff, that should be ok!!! I think its an important issue and I’d really like staff to come up with some procedures. I just CAN”T imagine there are so many cases where a post has to be monitored or deleted that it would take up too much of staff’s time to discuss the situation and how to proceed. Or am I wrong and does staff delete a lot of posts?

« Last Edit: May 29, 2008, 12:28:07 PM by lindape54 » Report to moderator 74.71.222.53 (?)

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

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Quote from: flowergirl_1970 on May 29, 2008, 12:01:08 PM
I’m questioning a procedure, not you!!!! And I think there should be a more solidified procedure in place than, what you’ve outlined below. This is the place for us to speak our voice and it might not always be positive, but this is a forum for expressing opinions … for those who otherwise wouldn’t have a voice at all. Sometimes that voice includes offering constructive feedback to staff, that should be ok!!! I think its an important issue and I’d really like staff to come up with some procedures. I just CAN”T imagine there are so many cases where a post has to be monitored or deleted that it would take up too much of staff’s time to discuss the situation and how to proceed. Or am I wrong and does staff delete a lot of posts?

Staff hardly ever deletes posts. We do have moles in here. And sometimes things are taken off the boards that PJ/AZ will take off and twist around. There are folks on this board that are targets of AZ and we have to keep that in mind. I will bring up this topic at our next staff meeting.
Linda

« Last Edit: May 29, 2008, 12:28:37 PM by lindape54 » Report to moderator 12.208.0.215 (?)

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flowergirl_1970
Member

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GREAT! I think that’s a really good idea. I understand the AZ/PJ issue totally!!

Quote from: lindape54 on May 29, 2008, 12:07:57 PM
Staff hardly ever deletes posts. We do have moles in here. And sometimes things are taken off the boards that PJ/AZ will take off and twist around. There are folks on this board that are targets of AZ and we have to keep that in mind. I will bring up this topic at our next staff meeting.
Linda

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equal justice

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Quote
Cheryl

ROD WAS WRONG. I told him that. I just did not say it on the boards. Cheryl you ARE contributing to the escalation of things, I am not the only staff member that thinks that.

I DID NOT throw my COO under the bus. You were being just as nasty and cattie ON THE OPEN FORUM as they were. Think about it. Reread the things you wrote. Oh I forgot I deleted that whole thread. Here it is See who STARTED the shit. Cheryl You have been deleting posts of Lets and Flower that just plan piss you off. This has been brewing for a while. PLEASE except my apology if I hurt your feelings. That breaks my heart. I love you But I thought all 3 of you guys were wrong PERIOD
Topic: Confrontation vs. conversation (Read 145 times)

I already posted the thread Linda. Look above and read what I wrote I already went thru it.
You know that staff has not been privy to all the shit Rod has been throwing at me.
We have all been doing our fair share of deleting.
I deleted the thread that Flower girl started that was esclating into a blame game over why Rod left sosen. You thought your ONE SENTENCE was going to stop it and it did not. It got worse. I deleted it, told you and staff that I did and why and when I talked to you about it you agreed that it should not have been on the forum…how quickly we do forget!
I did NOT put quotes into my post on that thread. I did NOT identify anyone. Only the ones who were GUILTY of engaging in the inapropriate behavior I was describing would even have thought it was about them. I was NOT saying the things flower girl kept insinuating that I was saying.
NO dear, you did NOT delete that whole thread. Just my words asking flower girl if she had a bug up her butt about something because she just kept pounding on about censorship and not letting it go or taking it to pm like I asked.
You keep refusing to address the obvious!
You had been trying to get lets to stop for a month, it did not work because you were trying to smooze him and he was busy manipulating the hell out of you.
He has been harrassing me since static was asked to be secretary and even before. YOU SAID YOURSELF that he reads stuff into things others says and that he is a loose cannon. You have bitched about Lets over and over…yet when the time comes to DO something about it, you refuse because the shit is not being directed at you.
It seems we are at an impass.
I made a general statement that was meant as a “if the shoe fits” statement. Obviously the shoe did fit.
You refused to back me up in public when Lets and FG was slamming me in public. I did not want much, like I said just a statement from Ms. THE BUCK STOPS HERE, saying that they were reading stuff into my post that I did not say and to stop it.
Not a great big humungous deal…just a very little thing. My work as COO at SOSEN was not important enough for you to do that…AFTER you told me on the phone that YOU WOULD!
Rehashing and rehashing this is not doing a bit of good.
You made your choice yesterday with your actions.
You would not even answer the phone when I called.
You would not have the teleconference that Top wanted.
Now you want to look like you are being all consilitory after you broke my heart and betrayed me big time over some little thing.
So spin it any way you want Linda. I KNOW< YOU KNOW< LETS KNOWS AND FG KNOWS exactly what has been going on
Even if others don’t. They werent involved in my desperate, shocked phone calls to you yesterday or all the garbage that has been going on.
You know damn well sosen was my life and my family. YOU choose to protect your precious nothing but sunshine reputation over that. There ARE times, Linda, when it is time to STOP sitting on your hands and act, but oh yeah you did do that didnt you when you deleted my resignation and kicked me out of the fourm and adm. I almost forgot….NOT

Quote
Cheryl you ARE contributing to the escalation of things, I am not the only staff member that thinks that.
thanks for rubbing salt into the wounds.
There are some staff members who agree with me that Lets has been using power and control and manipulating and whining and has been harassing people and that his staff contact message was outrageous and unexceptable along with his stupid name. But I was not trying to turn this into a popularity contest. I know who has gained the most populatrity because dummy me just say back in the shaddows and did the tough jobs with out blowing my own horn.
I has stopped crying yesterday, you have managed to start it up again. You just keep kicking me while I am down under that buss you threw me under…
Enough of this shit. You apologize if you hurt me…. YOU DROVE A KNIFE IN MY HEART my showing me just how little I meant to you, now you want me to be sure that I am the one seen as wrong for asking you to write 2 damed sentences.
Words are EASY Linda, I found that out. But ACTIONS speak louder than words. I have already discussed your actions.

« Last Edit: May 30, 2008, 12:14:28 PM by equal justice » Report to moderator Logged

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

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Cheryl Honey, I don’t know what is going wrong with your personal life but you did mention to me something that your neurologist said to you. Your behavior is totally inappropriate. It is NOT “them” it is you. If it walks like a duck……
You need to let this go. To are seeing “slights” in posts that are just not there. You are combative and aurguemenitive to some of trhe members just cause you have an “issue with them. Not every post needs a damn kattie comment. I hate to say this sweetie but you are acting like Shirley.
Talk a walk , watch a movie, read a good book, maybe it would not be a bad idea to take your Dr’s advice.
Hugs
Linda
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equal justice

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Quote from: lindape54 on May 30, 2008, 12:23:51 PM
Cheryl Honey, I don’t know what is going wrong with your personal life but you did mention to me something that your neurologist said to you. Your behavior is totally inappropriate. It is NOT “them” it is you. If it walks like a duck……
You need to let this go. To are seeing “slights” in posts that are just not there. You are combative and aurguemenitive to some of trhe members just cause you have an “issue with them. Not every post needs a damn kattie comment. I hate to say this sweetie but you are acting like Shirley.
Talk a walk , watch a movie, read a good book, maybe it would not be a bad idea to take your Dr’s advice.
Hugs
Linda

Please do not patronize me linda. It won’t work with me. It might work with some gullable others but it wont work with me.
So lets can post that BULLSHIT stuff about why he is saying I DO WHAT I DO, when we all know from his letter what it means but I can’t call him on it and speak the truth?!?!? My behavior is totally apropriate for someone who has had others belitteling them and lying about them. For someone who was so completly betrayed by you and is continuing to be betrayed by you.
Yea, I told youi yesterday that I had to take care of MY mental health too. So you put in this crap. What a laugh. It’s ok if YOU get angry and rant, its ok that ROD gets angry and rants for months, but Cheryl gets angry and she gets thrown under the bus.
You are getting pretty DIRTY in your tricks now Linda. OH you got the power now and you are using it like a mighty sword.
Bullshit is ok to post on the forums but linda mighty hand is on the delete button if I post.
Go ahead and say I am acting like Shirley, but we all know WHO called Shirley on her behavior and got her the hell out of SOSEN. ME
We all know who was on a huge power trip, Ms CEO it was Shirley and now you have taken her place beautifully. They say Power Corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutly… Ms. THE BUCK STOPS HERE. I would never have believed it of you tho.
The slights I see are damn well there and you know it. You would be throwing a major hissy fit if all their crap was thrown at you.
I remember some of your fits.
There is no one on the BOD who follows all of what is going on except me and you.
There is no one I can think of who follows all the stuff that is going in staff except me, you and Billm.
Ask Billm what HE thinks of all this.

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

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Honey I am not going to put Bill in the middle of this. You CAN NOT posts PERSONAL ATTACKS on the forum PERIOD

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equal justice
SOSEN Staff
Member

I was not putting bill in the middle of anything. You are the one saying staff agrees with you.
It was not a personal attack, it was the truth as I saw it. It was ok for Rod to mistate my words and intentions and to try to cover his lying ass but not ok for me to call it like it is.
OK, I got ya.
Heil Linda.
Heil Lets
Tough shit Cheryl

equal justice
SOSEN Staff

Honey, You also picked a great time for me but a bad time for SOSEN to show me your true colors. Yesterday I was finishing the ATSA article…but that got interupted. I am glad it did before I told the professional world how great sosen is. Oh the members on the whole may be, but….well, you know

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

Yea I know…I am ugly and my mother dresses me funny.

Why you would hurt the members to get back at me is class

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

Cheryl you need to act like a professional We need to lead by example

equal justice
SOSEN Staff
Member

This has nothing to do with hurting the members, It is about my not endorsing an orginization who allowes its members to use cognitive distortions and manipulative behavior to injure members of the management.

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

Oh so now you graduated medical school. The ONLY person having cognitive distortions right now is YOU! STOP! WALK AWAY FROM THE FUCKING CUMPUTER

Look Cheryl Your OWN DR is telling you that you need a psychiatrist. It is not EVERYBODY ELSE It is YOU NOW STOP

equal justice
SOSEN Staff
Member

Oh yea you led really well yesterday linda. You have been allowing yourself to be manipulated and sucked up to.
You have allowed your popularity in the fourm to dictate who you would and would not support.
A Professional would not have lied to me when they told me that they were going to “post right now and put a stop to this” when I asked you to tell Lets and Flower girl that they were putting words in my mouth that I did not say and making me sound like some kind of crazed dictator. You could not even post something like, Now, you know Cheryl does not do those things or think like that. SHe has worked hard to have an open forum and get members to voice their opinions and implement suggestions.
HELL NO! Delete what cheryl said and Leave the garbage Lets and Flower wrote.
Ignore Cheryls needs and her pain, for the sake of your butt kissing lets and flower.
THAT Linda is not professional.
Allowing someone who has worked long and hard for this orginization to be pushed out the door so that YOU can save face, IS NOT PROFESSIONAL>

equal justice
SOSEN Staff
Member

Quote from: lindape54 on Today at 01:51:39 PM
Oh so now you graduated medical school. The ONLY person having cognitive distortions right now is YOU! STOP! WALK AWAY FROM THE FUCKING CUMPUTER

Look Cheryl Your OWN DR is telling you that you need a psychiatrist. It is not EVERYBODY ELSE It is YOU NOW STOP

I am wondering just how low you will sink linda.
You tell only a small piece of the story here about my dr. telling me to see a psychiatrist and it has nothing to so with SOSEN, it has to do with my memory problems.
Also, that was told to you in a private conversation, the little bit that I had time to tell you.
No linda I have not graduated medical school, but I am a nurse with training in such matters.
I am not saying it is EVERYBODY ELSE. I am saying YOU blew it big and will say and do anything to deny it.
But the psychiatrist bit is low, even from what I have learned of you in the last 24 hours.
I would NEVER reveal stuff you have told me in private. There are lots of other things I have not revealed also because it would hurt you, but you don’t seem to have those filters.
and I cannot step away from the F ing computer, honey, cuz I have to totally re write my atsa article if I am going to get it in in time.

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

Cheryl there is something in psychology called “transference” I would bet my life that is what is going on here with you. I have had the patients of a saint with you the last 2 days. YOU WILL NOT STOP.
I am not going to allow you to bagger me all day. Now STOP

equal justice
SOSEN Staff
Member

And the term for what you are doing is DENIAL and projecting.
Am I baggering you or am I standing up for myself in the only place you have allowed me too.
Seems like you are baggering ME too.
Thats ok Linda, you are the ALL POWERFUL OZ now, I fully expect you to knock me out of being able to post at all again.
You already took away every thing else.
You won’t answer the phone if I call. You wouldnt yesterday, Miss I am wonderful and I am being so very kind to the poor disturbed Linda. You make it look like you have tried to be sooooo good, but we both know the truth to that don’t we.
I have nothing more to say to you anyway. You just come up with the same bull shit excuses and sink even lower by bringing up something that had nothing to do with anything.
I’m done trying to answer your charges.
You are right this became stupid long ago.
But lets not exaggerate, it has been just a little over 24 hours, not double that

I am the CEO and she’s MY Sarah Tofte

2008-09-25T23:30:00.000-07:00

letsgetreal50

Linda,

What’s up with Sarah?

letsgetreal50

For a person who is suppose to be all excited about this symposium and “IS IN,” sure doesn’t seem like she is interested at all. She is disappointing me big time.

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

I do not know what is going on with Sarah. She has not called me back I was out one week and she was out the other. She speaks all over the country. All I can do is keep trying. Why don’t we just go ahead and write the letters for other speakers just saying that Sarah was invited to speak also

letsgetreal50

Well, Ive made a decision. If I don’t hear from Sarah this week than I’m cancelling the symposium.

I cannot tell you how let down I feel. Very few people even visit the Ok symposium web site because no one gives a good rats ass.

I’ve had more people than I can count ask me if they could help and after I reply, I never hear from them again.

Example: Stick said he would do the bumper sticker. Great, I liked the one he did and asked him for pricing and never heard from him again. I have PM’d him at least 4 times AND HE DOES VISIT THE FORUM FREQUENTLY. THERE IS NO REASON OR EXCUSE TO TREAT ME LIKE THIS.

I’ve had people ask me if they could help on the CFCoklahoma site. I say yes, and never hear from them.

If people arn’t serious when they open their mouth, then they need to keep it shut!!!!!!!!!!!

I am sick and tired of the sex offender community. Lazy people who dug the hole their in and refuse to help themselves out. They seem to expect everyone to do their part for them.

Most in staff know that when I say I’ll do something, it’s money in the bank. I expect no less from anyone else. Say what you mean and mean what you say.

I put in a lot of hours, drove to OK City, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Fuck it! Just FUCK IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Lets

static
SOSEN Staff
Member

I’m at my Gf’s house on the other side of the state right now, and don’t have access to my hard drive, but I’ll get the Ok legal info to you as soon as I can. I have also put out the word about the symposium to many people in my network and they trust my word. Can I guarantee that all or any of them will show up? no. But I gave them my word and if I’m going to be their source of info, they have to be able to trust what I tell them. As for Sarah, who made the decision that the symposium depended upon her participation? There can be other speakers. I was under the impression that we were contacting many people to speak. Why be rude to them and cancel on them just because Sarah hasn’t answered in a time-frame that is acceptable to you? And who in the world told you she would be available to you whenever you beckoned? I’m not trying to be rude here, Lets, but if you make me look like a poor source of info to my network, just because Sarah isn’t at your service, you are doing me, my network, and in the end Oklahoma, a disservice. We don’t have a boat-load of SO’s in Ok. We certainly don’t have many members from here. Thwarting the network I’m trying to build will let me down a bit more than Sarah has let you down. If you want to cancel the Symposium, that’s cool- but do it now, so I can tell all the people that I’ve contacted (trying to make it a success) and tell them in a timely fashion. I’m not trying to pressure you into holding the symposium if you feel that it is not going to work. In fact I have some reservations about it’s success myself, and we can always try some other time- it’s no big deal right now to cancel, and no one can say you haven’t put your all into this. But maybe it would be more successful at a later date- you may be right. What I’m trying to make clear to you is that if we cancel, we need to do it now, to avoid getting in over our heads and embarassing SOSEN and ourselves- either by cancelling at the last minute or holding an amateurish symposium. So Lets- if you want to cancel, we can do that with minimal damage if we do it now.

I just re-read what I’ve written in this post and it reads like I’m griping at you. I hope you don’t take it that way, because I didn’t mean it that way at all. If you cancel, I’ll support your decision. If you don’t cancel, then we need to not base all our hopes on Sarah. If she can do it, she’ll let us know, but we can have other good speakers ready just in case.

bronkv
SOSEN Staff
Member

I’m sorry to hear how you’re feeling Lets, I’d like to help out with the OK Symposium, but with looking after my mother and children, I doubt that I’d be able to attend. I’m sure I could help out with other parts of the Symposium though (brochures, website etc), I just don’t know where to start (maybe we could kick around some ideas in the Education Committee?)

I agree with Static, I don’t think the Symposium depends upon Sarah’s appearance. I think it would be great if we could just get our voices carrying the truth out there, and just make our voices heard. It would also be good if we could get video of it and put it up on the main page.

letsgetreal50

Well, Just when I get to the end of my tether, Sarah Tofte sends me an e-mail apologizing for the delay and promises she will get back to me this week.

Now, we only have 8 weeks to prepare and I have made it clear to the committee that I am as green as a spring apple. I need writers movers and shakers. I’m going back to committee and see if I can move and shake them into action. I do not see that we have enough time,

Stick promised to make bumper stickers for a fund drive. He doesn’t respond to my e-mails, and other members blah, blah,blah. We are running out of time.

equal justice
COO, Media Director
SOSEN Staff
Member

hey Lets, I am glad you got a response from Sarah. I am kinda confused tho, wasnt Linda the contact person for Sarah?
Just wondering.

letsgetreal50

Let’s just be thankful that Sarah responded and will get back to us this week. We have work to do and that is what it is all about. As Static says, his “credibility is at stake.” So is mine, and so it is with others. We have a great opportunity to have a great impact here so we need to focus on that.

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

I am confused also Rod. I have been cultivating my relationship with Sarah for 3 years. I asked you when I was in the hospital not to contact her, that I would take care of it. I get MANY MANY reporters sent our way because of her. If you want me to do something, I do it. I do not appreciate you writing to Sarah when I asked you not to.

letsgetreal50

Sorry, but my writing Sarah does not interfere with Sarah referring to you or you to her in anyway shape or form. I’m not going to get into any kind of argument or politics. Sarah’s e-mail address is public, and anyone can e-mail her for any reason. She is not owned by anyone and neither am I.

I spent a good two weeks collecting monies and coordinating for you and your husbands move out of VA and into Ohio. Lets just be glad Sarah finally responded, because I was ready to quit this entire effort. I’m very sick and tired of all these RSO’s who do nothing but want everyone to do for them. That makes up 90 percent of our membership. Sorry, thats just where I am right now. It’s one of those things.

I’m a doer and go getter. I don’t have time for those who want to sit on the sidelines.

I wished you knew who and how many volunteered to help with my site AND the symposium, only to never hear from them again. Incredible. It makes one want to throw up their hands and say. Well, I already expressed that

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

Rod
I do not like my toes being stepped on. You asked me to do something. I did it. The last time I checked I was the CEO. The CEO asked you not to interfere with her contact. You can take care of the whole damn symposium I QUIT

letsgetreal50

Now that’s one hell-of-a-way to treat someone who went ALL out for hours and days on end, to help you and your husband. You have no idea of the phone calls I made across this country to get you out of that evicted slave shack situation. I guess that’s gratitude for you. Ego is a bitch

I think this is more of a ego problem and is reminiscent of the Shirley days. If you want to take your ball and go home, that’s up to you. Pretty immature from where I sit.

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

Call it what you want. I am nothing like Shirley and you know it. I specificly asked you NOT to write to Sarah, to let me handle it. I worked for YEARS helping her and gaining her trust. You overstepped your bounds. PERIOD I am the CEO here not you. The CEO asked you to honor that request for a reason You KNEW when you wrote Sarah that I would not be happy with it but you did it anyway.

letsgetreal50

Your problem isn’t with me!!! Why Sarah chose to respond to me and not with you lies with Sarah. You have been calling and e-mailing and like you said, You couldn’t understand why she wasn’t responding. You said, she always responds immediately to you. Ask Sarah.

The good news is like I said, she responded and will get back in touch this week.

Letsgitoverit

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

Rod
I worked with Sarah for 2 years on the HRW report before anyone even knew who Sarah was.I know how busy she is. I am very protective of her just like she is of me. The point is you asked me to contact her and take care of it. I was. I asked you to let me handle it. You totally ignored my request. That is what I am upset about.

letsgetreal50

Well, I didn’t totally gnor you. You had a couple of months to get a reply and that never happened. I did what i thought I had to do because of the late date. I explained to Sarah that the committee was at a standstill until we heard from her. And it was. Time is running out and there is much money to raise and committee will have to get the lead out of their ass and get busy.

Sorry to have disappointed you. Glad Sarah responded. Yes, you are the CEO and I have ALWAYS respected that. I am the committee chairperson and need all the help I can get. When I see someone failing, I’m the one who gets in there and does things to make it happen.

You may feel disrespected and I understand that. However, absolutely no harm done to your relationship with Sarah Tofte, there is no reason why you cannot continue to do what you have been doing.

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

Rod
I love and respect you. I am sorry. Let us just put this behind us now. We have work to do.
HUGS
Linda

letsgetreal50

Amen, I do love and respect you too.

hugs, Rod

Cyber Warriors - a vigilant group of extraordinary individuals

2008-09-25T22:42:00.000-07:00

Cyber Warriors - a vigilant group of extraordinary individuals

ZMan!
Member

Cyber Warriors - A new breed of superheroes battle online child predators.
« on: Today at 01:27:04 AM »

Thought you might find this interesting..

http://www.imperfectparent.com/articles/articles455_1.php

Like watching a presentation of what goes on in a slaughterhouse while eating a steak dinner, sometimes it’s better to live in ignorant bliss. After all, if we spent our entire day dwelling on all the cruelty and injustice in the world, most of us would wind up in the fetal position under the covers and not get anything done. There are those that take it to extremes, and never watch the news for this very reason. “Too much death, sadness and destruction,” they say, “I’d rather not know.” Same goes for the dangers that face our children – sometimes you just want to play at the park, or snuggle and read a book, and not dwell on potential evil awaiting them such as online predators.

But in the interest of child safety it’s our duty to be aware. This new breed of predator has taken away the idea of our home as a safe haven as they infiltrate through the bandwidth coming in from the wall. A child can longer be carefree. A parent cannot rest or be taken off guard. As soon as children are old enough, they must learn that there are people out there that are ready to prey on them as if they were animals in the wild. It’s certainly enough to make your heart ache and your stomach twist with worry. But it also makes us angry. These perverted minds don’t have the right to take away our children’s innocence. They don’t have a right to ruin children’s lives they’ve never even met. These pedophiles have no remorse, no compassion, and only a collective grassroots effort will help shut them down once and for all.

Fortunately for us, there is a vigilant group of extraordinary individuals who offer up an enormous amount of their time and resources to save children from the dark shadows of fear and pain before it ever happens to them. They are superheroes, flying through cyberspace, each with their own unique strength. They are not afraid of these pedophiles; in fact, they look them straight in the eye and say, “Bring it on!”

They’ve been dubbed the “Antis”, as in anti-pedophilia/anti-pedophile. The cowardly online predators have perhaps finally met their match — the Antis have law enforcement and a large host of volunteers on their side, as well as knowledge and resources. The Antis resolve is determined and unfaltering. They work day and night to destroy the child molester’s ability to prey on children and shut down their support networks, and they will not rest until every pedophile becomes the hunted instead of the hunter. So far, they have been wildly successful. The folks behind blogs and websites like ACME Cleaning Services and Absolute Zero have contributed to shutting down hundreds of pedophile blogs, websites, social groups and support forums.

While some forms of pedophile propaganda are protected by the First Amendment, that does not always apply when the websites promote criminal behavior or conspiring to hurt, violate, rape and molest children. Also, since the blogs and websites are on private hosting services, they are subject to the host’s “terms of service” (TOS) usage policies which prohibit certain behaviors.

Some of the more popular sites, such as Perverted Justice, have thousands of members. Perverted Justice is best known for its partnership with Dateline NBC’s To Catch a Predator with Chris Hansen. Perverted Justice has long been part of sting operations in which no children are ever involved. Instead, adults, acting as children, set up profiles and wait for predators to solicit them. Perverted Justice has also recently launched the “Wikisposure Project”. Using the wiki format ala Wikipedia, Wikiposure has categories which include state sex offenders with their rap sheets and full profiles included. Unlike Wikipedia, however, edits are controlled by a select group of people instead of being open to the public, for obvious reasons.

Absolute Zero takes a similar route — contributors write exposés on pedophiles and pedophile websites. Run by some of the bravest volunteers on the planet, their comments section is full of pedophiles putting forth a lot of effort to protest the Antis’ work, with pathetic results for their efforts. After spending little time on the blog, it is clear that the predators are feeling the effects of the tables being turned. To use the old cliché, the hunters have now become the hunted. Absolute Zero has been accused of conducting a “witch hunt”, but this dedicated group remains undaunted.

ACME Cleaning Services are expert “scrubbers” of pedophile porn and adult exploitation websites and blogs. Through various methods, a team of dedicated individuals work tirelessly to take back blogs originally containing pedophile propaganda

When asked about support and obstacles in the war on internet pedophile terrorism, “Rez” from ACME Cleaning services says, “Anyone who supports what we do is helping and aiding us. Lazy, incompetent people who won’t remove pedo[phile] filth are occasionally a hindrance. But we’ve been able to convince a lot of them that it’s better to be on the side of right. We’re still working on the others.”

We asked “Jacey” what made him interested in hunting down predators and pedophiles on the internet.

“I know victims of sexual abuse, when you’re close to someone who’s been abused you’re also living with the after effects sexual abuse,” Jacey says. “When you’ve seen what it does to someone, you develop a pretty big feeling of hurt/anger/pain against people who spend their time trying to legalize this shit - sleazoids that treat the violation of someone else body as nothing more than a joke or an obstacle that stands in their way.”

Many other Antis have also come into the fight after being victims of abuse themselves. One such person is “Violet Leaves”, who says, “I am a survivor of childhood sexual abuse. I want to stop these monsters from hurting another child. I also have daughters of my own.”

The fight is definitely personal for her — she spends over 40 hours a week on the cause, with her purpose being, “to make people aware of the dangers of pedophiles, exposing pedophile lies, and propaganda.”

The Antis movement is not without criticism. Some look down on what they consider vigilante methods, harassment, entrapment, and violations of free speech. Perhaps Sues, who also puts in full-time hours towards the Anti cause, meets this objection with sobering clarity when she says, “Free speech does not mean free to do harm. Plastering pictures of children on the internet for other pedophiles to use for pleasure is harmful. Encouraging adult-child sex is harmful. Offering ways to keep from being caught by parents and law enforcement, while gaining access to children is harmful. Talking about how sexy a toddler is in diapers is not only harmful, but disgusting as well.

“These are just some of the things that pedophiles do. They claim that web hosting companies deny their right to free speech to talk about raping children. That statement alone shows how wrong they are.”

Sues, referring to her child advocacy work and her website, “Warriors For Innocence was started by my brother and me. We branched out and wanted to create a place that was family friendly in the midst of a nasty subject. Educating the public on how these predators work is so important. It is a large part of what I do. If everyone knew how these monsters operated, there would be a lot less victims out there.

“During my time online I have seen some horrific images of child abuse and rape. It has changed me and driven me to continue hunting the monsters that prey on our children. Those images are forever burned into my mind. It is because of that abuse that I fight the evil that is the predator.

“My reason for doing this is simple and I state it every time in my signature: ‘I hunt and fight monsters. If I can help to get even one monster off of the street and away from kids, then it was worth any amount of effort.’”

Many of the Antis are also contributors to Absolute Zero, which acts as a main hub of information about pedophiles and exposes their communications and multiple identities. Comments are allowed from both Antis and pedophiles, which creates a unique and sometimes compelling environment. Many pedophiles post under the guise of wanting to help or of being an Anti themselves — this ruse rarely lasts very long, however, as the Absolute Zero contributors and followers are astute and expose them before they have a chance to be taken seriously. The site owner, “Stitches”, is a master of cyber-detective work, putting pedophiles on notice and educating the public while briefing her legion of dedicated writers and volunteers.

These sites are not for the faint of heart — they are full of truth and facts that most parents would rather not know. It is stuff that nightmares are made out of, yet this group of very special people are not afraid. They’ve made a pledge to fight for the “safety and emotional well-being of all children” and will not rest until the war is won. The world is a safer place due to these extraordinary individuals, and as parents we should be grateful for the work they do and hopefully have a new appreciation for great deeds that never get the full attention they deserve.

fallenone
Member

Re: Cyber Warriors - A new breed of superheroes battle online child predators.
« Reply #1 on: Today at 01:30:50 PM »

And who did they pay off to promote this crock pot of shiitake mushrooms?

equal justice
COO, Media Director
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Cyber Warriors - A new breed of superheroes battle online child predators.
« Reply #2 on: Today at 02:08:04 PM »

Maybe it is run by one of them. Have you ever even HEARD of the imperfect parent before?

fallenone
Member

Re: Cyber Warriors - A new breed of superheroes battle online child predators.
« Reply #9 on: March 11, 2008, 10:40:44 AM »

I believe AZ’s efforts are nothing more than propaganda– Ironically, they run sites called girl/boychat and other pedo sounding sites. They create their own blogspots, claiming that sight was once a pedo site. Essentially they are using the strategy from the movie, “Canadian Bacon,” in which they are creating a fake war for the sake of popularity. I found a blogspot called “monsterinthecloset” or something like that, and it has the absolute zeroes retarded template and the bold claim that blogspot was once a pedo site. Yeah, right. And Saddam had “weapons of mass destruction.” I don’t respect absolute zeroes et al because they make up stuff to justify their own sick sadistic pleasures.

REALITY CHECK:

Some blogs are available in Webarchive

Original Site - Visit with Caution
Current version - Hijacked by Anti’s

static
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Cyber Warriors - A new breed of superheroes battle online child predators.
« Reply #10 on: March 11, 2008, 09:23:56 PM »

It’s pretty obvious to anyone who really checks them out, that they’re not interested in protecting kids, raising awareness, or anything else noble. Those things- if they happen at all- are just collateral benefits to their real passion.

Think about it- they aren’t wrong when they say that there are “pedos” on the web, talking about and sometimes attempting to harm kids. So, if that’s true- why do they bother with us? I see no one here doing any of those kinds of things. Our purpose is nothing like those kinds of sites (see notice at top of page). I can understand how- given the AZ world-view, they would see us as the enemy, but if their primary goal is protecting children, wouldn’t going after the people actually attempting to harm a child now be the first priority? But it’s not- discrediting us is their first priority. In fact, most of the time, they only really mention the truly dangerous sites when they try to somehow connect them with us. So, Az says there is an “epidemic” of online pedophile sites, online predators, kiddy-porn rings, but somehow we are their number one enemy… Doesn’t quite add up, unlesss they’re just full of crap to begin with.

This is all I’m writing about AZ for awhile- I’ve noticed they’re getting a lot of undue attention on the forum lately, and I don’t know why this new panic is taking hold of all of you. The best way to deal with them is to ignore them. Besides, it’s not like they’ve even accomplished much lately. They’re too busy trying to figure out how to save themselves in court. Let ‘em fade into obscurity- it’s more than they deserve.

robin2005
Member

Re: Cyber Warriors - A new breed of superheroes battle online child predators.
« Reply #3 on: March 10, 2008, 02:29:42 PM »

I agree with EJ… Superheroes? LOL I just got a mental image from the movie “The Incredibles” where the little costume lady refuses to make a cape for Mr. Incredible because of all the superheroes who met their demise when their capes got sucked into airplane engines, caught on a skyscraper..etc… laughing7

Harvardphd123
Member

Re: Cyber Warriors - A new breed of superheroes battle online child predators.
« Reply #5 on: March 10, 2008, 08:43:13 PM »

That article is the biggest load of crap I’ve smelled in a long time.

ZMan!
Member

Re: Cyber Warriors - A new breed of superheroes battle online child predators.
« Reply #6 on: March 10, 2008, 10:14:09 PM »

The way I see it, their intentions are good, to shut down true pedophiles and child porn sites, but they do not do that. They target ALL sex offenders, claiming they are all pedophiles and support pedophilia, which we all know is a load of BS.

Other states have proves their own police force can do this, so why do we need vigilante groups like PJ or AZ, etc doing this? Because I think they police are USING them as proxies. So if something goes wrong, the vigilantes get sued instead of the police force. Someone else to blame instead.

If they would stick to their original intentions, then IMO, it’s good. But the way they do it is not.

static
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Cyber Warriors - A new breed of superheroes battle online child predators.
« Reply #7 on: March 10, 2008, 11:30:06 PM »

I’m probably going to get yelled at by someone for this, but here goes:

I’ve seen how AZ, et al, “outs” certain pedophile sites like boychat, nambla, etc. A lot of people aren’t aware of these kinds of sites, even the ISP in some cases. If all the vigilantes ever did was help get rid of sites like that, I’d support them to my dying breath. The problem is that these groups aren’t satisfied with only going after online predators and pedo-propaganda- they deem anyone who disagrees with them “pedophile” or “pedophile enabler”. And even then- if they had evidence to back up their claims, I’d support them. But I’ve seen too many instances where someone who disagrees with them is subject to their on- and off-line harassment, with no evidence of any wrong-doing, other than whatever the “editors” of wikisposure feel like writing about them. To be fair (and they don’t deserve fairness, considering the lack of it in their dealings with others), they have run a lot of “critters” off the net- and that’s a good thing. But then they lump everyone they wish to harm into the same catagory as the real creeps.

There are many serious problems with the way these groups operate which, if detailed, would fill a library. But a few are:

They use the same “ends justify the means” excuse that has been used by most evil people since the dawn of time, thus destroying any credibility they may have had.

Groups like this foster an “us versus them” mentality, which eventually grows to include, not just their stated targets, but anyone who dissents from the prevailing group orthodoxy. (This is a major problem with the collectivist mentality as a whole, btw)

In the process of gaining power and recognition, they inevitably must add more and more “enemies” to their lists. Otherwise, what would they do if they ever won- just pack up and go home?.. Not likely…

There is a certain arrogance involved in casting yourself as judge, jury, and executioner- which leads to an overall increase in neuroses, combined with an over-inflated ego (not a good combo- in fact, not all that different from the “monsters” they claim to fight). Any RSO who has been through treatment can tell you about all the distorted thinking that must occur before an otherwise normal person can commit an offense. The vigilantes aren’t immune from the same screwy thinking as a rapist before he commits the crime. In fact, the thinking patterns are essentially the same… and equally dangerous to society. One person manifests his messed-up thinking sexually, another decides to harm others under the guise of “protecting” someone or something. Mentally, they are much more alike than different. This is one of the primary reasons I’m against these people. Anyone who’s been around here very long knows I’m a stickler about not getting into screwy thinking, and quick to respond to a member who demonstrates it. Why should the vigilantes be immune from being questioned on their own “distortions”? It is good, both here and in socety, to point out distorted thinking. I don’t like it when it appears on this forum, and I don’t like it when it is held up as some sort of heroic deed.

IMO, the only real difference between these so-called “heroes” and a SO about to re-offend is that the SO doesn’t have some numb-skull, like the author of the above article, to applaud their offense. People like that are enablers, just as much as a parent giving silent assent to the victimization of their child.

Perhaps, along with “pedo-enabler” we need a word to describe “online, arrogant, harassing, abusive nut-case enabler”? Oh yeah, there is a word for it– “moron”.

This is obviously from a small site that either doesn’t check their facts, or is run by the viilantes. I’m not giving it any more attention… What the rest of you do is your business.

(and to the trolls- feel free to quote me)

oldman_inmaine
Member

Re: Cyber Warriors - A new breed of superheroes battle online child predators.
« Reply #8 on: Today at 12:40:12 AM »

Quote
There is a certain arrogance involved in casting yourself as judge, jury, and executioner- which leads to an overall increase in neuroses, combined with an over-inflated ego (not a good combo- in fact, not all that different from the “monsters” they claim to fight).

I agree with just about every thing you wrote, I to see the same behavior in the “monsters” they take aim at. This group seems to be thinking like Pol Pot, and stating ” My conscience is clear”. While given orders to cleans the earth of the his monsters. BangHead

static
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Cyber Warriors - A new breed of superheroes battle online child predators.
« Reply #13 on: March 12, 2008, 11:24:26 PM »

Speaking of the “superheroes”- March 14th is Stitches’ 33rd Birthday. Everyone be sure to wish her a happy birthday if you run into her… she needs all the “good will” she can get…

Iron Fist Linda, If you don’t like it “Smite Me”

2008-09-24T23:26:00.000-07:00

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

Crisis of Conscience
« on: June 02, 2008, 10:47:11 PM »

My integrity mean everything to me. i will not be part of an organization that thinks it is Ok for staff member(static) and our COO to post personal attacks in the national forum. credibility credibility credibility It only gives PJ ammunition.

We had 2 meetings about this. And know everything that was discussed last night and Sat night means nothing. We have a policy and procedure That means nothing. thanks Static for writing the letter you said you would write to Cheryl.

I will not be given ultimatums.

I am working my ass off to get SOSEN national attention.There is a reason I do everything that I do. I have NEVER been accused of not being fair and reasonable. I will not let inexperienced members dictate to me how to run a forum or how to network with the other RSO agencies, So clear etc….

Cheryl crossed WAYYYY over the line. The Lets problem has already been decided on twice.

Linda

static
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Crisis of Conscience
« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2008, 11:25:23 PM »

I’ve attacked no one and won’t respond to this attack on me other than to say that I am actually a Board member with the same vote as you. I didn’t “dictate” anything that I wasn’t specifically asked to weigh in on. The person who asked me to intervene in your fight was you. My actions and words are very reasonable, and I’ve been equally tough on Cheryl for her part in this. The reason you aren’t privy to what I’ve said to Cheryl is that she is no longer allowed to communicate here, so my words to her had to be offered in emails and phone calls. I’ve given my opinions as anyone else here is allowed to do. The only time I “told” you or Cheryl what to do was when I demanded that you both stop acting like nincompoops. That particular subject was the one you asked me personally to weigh in on.

Everything else you see as some kind of attack is nothing more than me doing what I’ve always done and been lauded for- offering my opinion. I can’t help it that I’m the only one willing to say the things that we all are thinking, and I shouldn’t be discounted. I’m just as valuable as anyone else. There was a reason you called me and asked me to intervene in your fight- I can only assume that it was because my opinion mattered to you. But ever since I’ve gotten involved in your stupid, petty fight, you’ve belittled me and acted like I have no right to express myself about what everyone but you and Cheryl can see is very unacceptable behavior by both of you. If I’m so inexperienced, out of control, hot-headed, and stupid- why would you have ver asked me to intervene in the first place? I’m sorry Linda, but you’re reacting toward me out of anger which I neither deserve nor will put up with. Before you see me as some “boy” who doesn’t know his ass from a hole in the ground, you may want to think long and hard about what qualities of mine prompted you to call me and ask for me to intervene. And why you wanted me on Staff. And why you asked me to join the Board. And why you seem to have changed your mind now. I’m no Lets- I rarely do anything out of spite. And I’m not afraid to tell the truth- even when it pains me to tell it. I would respectfully ask you to consider whether you are taking out some of your anger on me without just cause. And I would ask you to think twice before running me out of Sosen or silencing me. I may be arrogant, but I think Sosen is better with me than without me- this is true of all Staff, IMO- Sosen needs all of us. I just happen to think that Sosen also needs Cheryl. Because you haven’t been able to see how hard I’ve been on Cheryl, you may have the impression that I’m one-sided in this. I assure you that I’ve said equally uncomfortable things to her. But those things needed to be said. Now the rest of us are just waiting with baited breath to see if either of you will listen. Cheryl is read only, so you have the power here to fix this or let it continue- she doesn’t. My every post since this crap started was trying to get either or both of you to see reason. For that, you are now mad at me. That’s ok, I’m thick-skinned, and I know that your anger toward me is misplaced. I’ve made no personal attacks against Lets- believe me when I tell you that there would be no ambiguity if I had. I think you know this…

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Crisis of Conscience
« Reply #2 on: June 02, 2008, 11:34:22 PM »

You call Lets out by name on this thread

Re: KARMA
« Reply #28 on: Today at 07:44:46 PM »

——————————————————————————–
Oldman, I couldn’t agree more. Thank you for staying reasonable so often.

This whole thread is a bit much. Anyone who wishes to smite me, feel free. You see, Karma points on a web forum don’t have any effect on my self-esteem. I rarely even bother to notice how many points I have. Karma is a good thing for the reasons Oldman gave. When it’s abused, it’s more a reflection on the person doing the abusing than the person getting smited.

And Lets- aren’t you the one who told me you were engaging in a “smite” campaign against another person here? I have no problem with that- as I said Karma’s really irrelevant to me. But it seems to me that you can’t get upset about someone abusing the Karma system if you are doing the same. In the end, it’s really just a stupid feature of our forum, and harmless. And diddling around with someone’s Karma is stupid and childish- of course that applies to EVERYONE who does it.

If I got on this forum and posted that I think Billm is a jerk (I don’t think that, but it’s an example), I really have no right to complain when he responds in kind. The same holds true for Karma. So how about everyone quit belly-aching about something so dumb, ok?

(and feel free to smite me for this post)

Report to moderator 4.244.93.16 (?)

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static
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: KARMA
« Reply #29 on: Today at 07:49:27 PM »

——————————————————————————–
No, “Applaud only” is the equivalent of no Karma at all. The truth is that Karma can be a very good way to give feedback to someone without flaming them. There’s a very simple solution to this problem-

Those who are engaging in stupid “Karma campaigns” should knock it off. And when they do engage in such stupidity, they should not complain when others do likewise. This is the solution. Anything else is just plain dumb.

Report to moderator 4.244.93.16 (?)

——————————————————————————–
billm
SOSEN Staff
Member

——————————————————————————–
Thanks Static, for the compliment.

Report to moderator 97.96.125.217 (?)

static
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: KARMA
« Reply #31 on: Today at 07:54:52 PM »

——————————————————————————–

Quote from: billm on Today at 07:49:56 PM
Thanks Static, for the compliment.

What a jerk!

(Thank God you’re not as over-sensitive as some others around here…)

Report to moderator 4.244.93.16 (?)

——————————————————————————–
LetsGetReal
Member

Re: Re: KARMA
« Reply #32 on: Today at 07:57:40 PM »

——————————————————————————–
No you have me mixed up with someone else static. I never engaged in a smite campaign against anyone. PERIOD. I don’t even know where you got that BS. I don’t do that and never did. That doesn’t mean I haven’t smited anyone, but after doing so, I went back and gave karma back

Report to moderator 64.149.38.55 (?)

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LetsGetReal
Member

Re: KARMA
« Reply #33 on: Today at 08:04:42 PM »

——————————————————————————–
In my opinion smiting is no different than bashing. This is suppose to be a support Network and smite is being abused. so is karma. I say do away with the thing. It’s stupid. I don’t give a hoot if I only have 5 but when people for no reason smite than it’s stupid. Well, stupid people do stupid things.
What can I say other than it is childish and immature.

In a way, this thread tells me more than I’ve known concerning some.

Thanks

Report to moderator 64.149.38.55 (?)

——————————————————————————–
static
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: KARMA
« Reply #34 on: Today at 08:11:13 PM »

——————————————————————————–
Lets- To coin a phrase- get real…

You told me about it in our last phone conversation. I didn’t take it very seriously because I honestly don’t care one way or the other about Karma- but you did tell me this yourself. I wouldn’t have brought it up, except that you are starting an entire thread complaining about someone doing the very same thing you were doing. I repeat- Karma wars are stupid. If you engage in them, you have no reason to complain when others respond in kind. What’s the big deal? If you wanted your old Karma points, you shouldn’t have deleted your membership. If you want to be at 50 Karma points or so again, then earn the points like you did the first time. Why is this such a big deal to you? This has got to be the silliest thread I’ve seen in a while.

Report to moderator 4.244.93.16 (?)

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LetsGetReal
Member

Re: KARMA
« Reply #35 on: Today at 08:14:52 PM »

——————————————————————————–
Granted, it is a silly thread. but there was NO FRIGGIN SMITE CAMPAIGN You mis understood. PERIOD

Report to moderator 64.149.38.55 (?)

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LetsGetReal
Member

Re: KARMA
« Reply #36 on: Today at 08:18:45 PM »

——————————————————————————–
Lets not get on the board the real reason I resigned from staff and my membership. I did NOTHING wrong. PERIOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It seemed to me that you were agreeing with my reasons as to why I resigned from staff. Unless of course you were playing me but that doesn’t fit you. I don’t see you as someone who would play another and then go behind their back.

Report to moderator 64.149.38.55 (?)

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static
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: KARMA
« Reply #37 on: Today at 08:25:00 PM »

——————————————————————————–

Quote from: LetsGetReal on Today at 08:04:42 PM

In a way, this thread tells me more than I’ve known concerning some.

If you’re refering to me, I have neither applauded nor smitten anyone in months. As I said before- Karma is not very important to me one way or the other. This is a senseless distraction (one of many the past few days), and I have every right to say so. If you don’t like it, smite me.

Report to moderator 4.244.93.16 (?)

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Kinsella
Member

Re: KARMA
« Reply #38 on: Today at 08:26:02 PM »

——————————————————————————–
I can’t beleive this thread is still going. Somebody on the staff make a decision and lets move on already. SOSEN is turning into a bad soap opera. Everyday we seem to spend more time attacking/defending someone. A lot of wasted energy if you ask me. If I didn’t know better I would think this was a chat room of middle schoolers.

Report to moderator 204.252.152.225 (?)

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static
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: KARMA
« Reply #39 on: Today at 08:30:16 PM »

——————————————————————————–
I’ve betrayed no one. It seems that when I voice agreement on a few things, it’s taken to mean that I agree with everything. I don’t completely 100% agree with anyone most of the time, and I don’t hide my opinions.

This thread is going into off-topic territory and getting a little personal, so it’s now locked.

static
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Crisis of Conscience
« Reply #3 on: Today at 12:17:18 AM »

Linda- would you please bring Cheryl back so that you’ll have someone to pick on besides me?

I’ve already explained myself on the other thread which deals with Lets’ Karma post. Everyone here knows that Lets was engaging in the very behavior he was complaining about. And to make matters worse, he was acting like it is some kind of failing of Sosen that this happened, when it was actually his own abuse of Karma that caused it. Now I could’ve told Lets what I really think about him, but instead I disagreed, gave damned good reasons for disagreeing and locked the thread when he started in on why he was “forced” to resign. Then I promptly reported here in Staff what was going on. These aren’t the actions of someone who is letting their anger get the best of them. Yes, I dared to use the mighty unmentionable name of Lets- this is because I was responding to him. If there’s some other way to respond to someone without using their name, I’d sure like to hear about it.

The truth is that you’re pissed and are using me as a whipping boy. You even called me “boy” on another thread. Knock it off. Or you will be as guilty of running people out of Sosen as you say Cheryl is. Kinda like Lets’ thread- you really shouldn’t complain about someone else’s behavior when you’re doing the same thing. I have tried to be patient because I know that this mess has put you under a lot of stress. But I’ve done nothing wrong to you or anyone else. I have and will continue to tell Cheryl when I think she’s wrong, and I’ll do the same with you. You were the one who dragged me into your fight. And you both are responsible for its effects on Sosen. Here’s an idea- think about your own part in this, consider whether an imperious attitude has worked thus far. Then think about trying something new. I’ve got as much right to my opinions as you- and I’m not currently bringing down Sosen because of a stupid grudge. Don’t you dare tell me about inexperience or bad judgment- it was your and Cheryl’s personal beef which started all this. I may be newer than you, but I’m not so new that I can’t see your irrationality. And unless you’re going to delete me next, I’ve got the same vote you have. Sheesh! If I’m such a nut, it sure doesn’t reflect well on your judgment- after all, every position I’ve held I was requested to hold. Now, it’s obvious that you have free reign to do as you wish. But as long as I’m still allowed to be here, I’ll damn sure express myself honestly. It would be wise to pick a new whipping boy. You brought me into this because you trusted my judgment. Have the courage to trust my judgment then… Because it’s obvious that your and Cheryl’s judgment is questionable right now.

So we can let this devolve into yet another argument, or you can go over to the thread you started -something about ending the drama- and respond to what I wrote there. I’m not your enemy, Linda- if you weren’t so pissed right now, you’d see that.

Rod was gonna turn this shit around and shove it up their ass with the help of Tmaximus95

2008-09-23T22:33:00.000-07:00

This is where staff comes in

letsgetreal50
SOSEN Staff
Member

This is where staff comes in.
« on: February 02, 2008, 03:42:30 AM »

——————————————————————————–
This is a copy of an e-mail that I sent to a post that Zman made entitled 2nd chance. -http://forum.sosen.us/index.php?topic=1885.msg7976#new

I am so excited for 2008.

We’re going to turn this shit around and shove it up their ass. Sorry, Got carried away there. LOL

Staff, we have another opportunity to join forces and create. What I do know is, several heads are better than one.

This is a positive and we must establish a relationship in order that we become stronger and a force to be reckoned with.

Feed back please.

My name is Rod Wagner, RFSO and staff member of sosen. At present I am heading a committee for a symposium to be held at 2300 N. Lincoln Blvd., Oklahoma City, OK. on May 2nd 2008 between the hours of 1 to 5 PM. The theme of the symposium is “More Harm Than Good.”

Guest speakers are Sarah Tofte of the Human Rights Watch Report “No Easy Answers.”

Cheryl Griffins, who will represent sosenfamily which is a group of victims and survivors of sexual abuse

Joann Pratt who spoke at the Ohio Sex Offender Rally on Dec 1, 2007

Dr. Steven Davidson will also speak

We are approaching Dr Jill Levenson

Spokes person from the Ohio Public Defenders Office

ACLU, Oklahoma

and many others.

This is NOT a sex offender rally but rather an educational symposium to educate the public, the citizens of Oklahoma.

20/20 will air on March 7, a program entitled “Sex in America.” You don’t want to miss it.

Please let me know if there is anything I can do to assist you.

Rod Wagner

aka letsgetreal

Pleas visit our site and get to know us.

I’m going to join your site. I want to get to know you.

Maximus Trillious to me

show details 12:43 AM (1 hour ago)

Hi Rod,

I looked at your mission statement and am happy to see so many folks building this national network…

I think one of the biggest problems is the psychological treatment industry pursuing all kinds of
congitive modification, and behavioral modification through strict, and sometimes over strict
regulations and restrictions. It goes against Ellis, and other pioneer’s in the behavioral modification field.

I have a great deal of knowledge in this area, and must say, I’m concerned. If you look at what
little statistics were available prior to all these new laws, they appear to be the same as they are now. I tend to think there’s a much bigger, hidden, agenda.
If 80% of the offenders released from prison do NOT re-offend over a 10-15 year term, that’s
reason enough to believe that maybe these particular laws are not cohesive with genuine reform, and cannot lend to reduce recidivism. I believe other avenues must be pursued.

The relapse prevention model, during treatment in prison, is a great way for guys to learn. However,
having participated in, and graduating from one of those programs, I can tell you that there’s a lot of
problems with them. In My State, Massachusetts, the DOC was contracting agencies that employed interns
which in turn led to a lot of problems. I believe that after 5 years of probation, a guy is pretty well established, or at least enough to carry on with life without creating another victim. But there are cases where treatment models, particularly those calling for self incrimination or be punished, are more detrimental to genuine rehabilitation.

The latest legislative trends smell a lot like McCarthyism to me. That’s how these laws were passed.
I would be happy to speak with you about legislative reform, and more importantly, treatment programs in America’s Correction Systems. I am no fan of ATSA, MATSA, etc… I found a great deal of psychotherapeutic hypocrisy that just wastes public resources.

Anyway, you can reach me at 978-710-3474. By the way, my folks are from Tulsa.

Thanks for the email,

——————————————————————————–

equal justice
COO, Media Director
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: This is where staff comes in.
« Reply #1 on: February 02, 2008, 07:19:52 AM »

——————————————————————————–
Rod,
OMG, please, please,please do not use Joanne’s name anywhere. Please list her as Jane Doe. Please contact anyone who you sent this email to and tell them the name was in error!!!!
Also, when referring to me use Cheryl Griffin. Do not release any info as to where I am from, Fl. is ok but nothing more specific.
Thanks

——————————————————————————–

letsgetreal50
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: This is where staff comes in.
« Reply #2 on: February 02, 2008, 11:42:41 AM »

——————————————————————————–
Will do.

——————————————————————————–

letsgetreal50
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: This is where staff comes in.
« Reply #3 on: February 02, 2008, 11:45:49 AM »

——————————————————————————–
I’m going to call this guy today. If any of you have questions you want me to ask or statements, jot them down here and I’ll relay them.

Lets

——————————————————————————–

equal justice
COO, Media Director
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: This is where staff comes in.
« Reply #4 on: February 02, 2008, 12:11:56 PM »

——————————————————————————–
Will he put a link to our site on his?
Would he like his link on our site?

——————————————————————————–

letsgetreal50
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: This is where staff comes in.
« Reply #5 on: February 02, 2008, 01:10:50 PM »

——————————————————————————–
Thats a question that I do want to ask him. For sure.

I joined his site, I don’t see a texed forum as I didn’t look all that hard. but he has Skype for audio communication. I’ll have to get head phone and mike. I’m not quite sure how that works.

——————————————————————————–

letsgetreal50
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: This is where staff comes in.
« Reply #6 on: February 02, 2008, 02:22:48 PM »

——————————————————————————–
This man Walter, also known as TMaximus95 is a MAJOR find. I spoke with him at length He is not just putting a link to us but we have our own Button on his Home page. Also he has 100’s of blogs and each will reference sosen.us.

We need a “Button” on our Home page and return the favor.

It should link to this url: -http://www.2nd-chance.info/

He is going to join forum.sosen.us and has extremely valuable information that I request he post. We need to approve him ASAP.

He very intelligent and well thought out. He is also doing a cost analyst that will blow your mind. I think right now, his figures are 168 Billion a year to house and monitor RSO’s and that at this point is probably conservative.

——————————————————————————–

gratefulhoo
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: This is where staff comes in.
« Reply #7 on: February 02, 2008, 05:55:53 PM »

——————————————————————————–
Good job Lets!

——————————————————————————–

REALITY CHECK:

TMaximus95:

It’s my belief that the government has no business dictating to any family what age their child is able to consent to sexual relations.

Some children mature earlier than others. I don’t think that the government has a right to undermine or subvert human nature or childhood development, especially when it comes to human sexuality because love, (and sex is a part of love) is something that’s natural.

And kids need to learn how to love, they need to be taught how to love.

We know a line has to be drawn somewhere but sex is a normal growing experience and is not a horrible crime when there’s no force involved. It’s all a part of everyone’s life

my crimes involved the manipulation and bribery of several teenage boys (age 14 to 16 years old) to allow me to have sexual relations with them. My crimes were not physically violent. That is, I didn’t force anyone into anything, but I did use money and gifts to gain their cooperation.

Cheryl Griffiths Attempts to Cover up her Cover-up Attempt

2008-09-22T22:30:00.000-07:00

HELP Immediate action needed

equal justice
COO, Media Director
SOSEN Staff
Member

——————————————————————————–
Tsand is writing as Zman on the newspaper comment section ://.nwfdailynews.com/article/12657/1
He is damaging sosen badly.
I cannot find any way of asking for deletion of posts and when I call the online staff number there is only a recording that there is not office hours.
Can anyone find where to contact to get this stopped???!!!!
I sent an email to nathan_land@link.freedom.com>, who is listed as web master I don’t know what else to do but Tsand is using another persons name and is telling lies and stole posts from ROAR
——————————————————————————–
It is certain, in any case, that ignorance, allied with power is the most ferocious enemy of justice-Martin Luther King Jr.

Billm

——————————————————————————–
Screenshots of person posing as Zman

://.sendspace.com/file/xagjgz

equal justice
COO, Media Director
SOSEN Staff
Member

——————————————————————————–
God bless you Bill.
Also, I need all the info on Tsand, Brown Billy
johnjohnson@yahoo.com
Bcu
Toes in the mud
that we can get. I need ip’s other aliases, other screen names ANYTHING and I need it FAST.
All our researchers please go to it.
——————————————————————————–
It is certain, in any case, that ignorance, allied with power is the most ferocious enemy of justice-Martin Luther King Jr.

equal justice
COO, Media Director
SOSEN Staff
Member

——————————————————————————–
HEY where is everybody>>>>>
I am in desperate need to find a way to contact an actual person at the daily news Northwest Fl Daily News
WE are taking a BEATING there and it is a brawl. I cannot get ahold of a PERSON there to get this shit shut down.
Can any one find something for me;
OR at least post here that you are looking or couldnt find anything
——————————————————————————–
It is certain, in any case, that ignorance, allied with power is the most ferocious enemy of justice-Martin Luther King Jr.

gratefulhoo
SOSEN Staff
Member

——————————————————————————–
Cheryl, I don’t know how to help but I wanted to at least respond.

I’m not sure how much help you’re going to get from the paper since they used statements off of ROAR witout even bothering to try to contact anybody from there. That’s incredibly irresponsible. They misinterpreted and skewed information taken out of context - just like AZ/PJ. With that level of journalism, I’m not sure they will care what you think.
——————————————————————————–

Billm

——————————————————————————–
Screen shots with comments Child Porn Suspect Wants Reform

://.sendspace.com/file/mkylyh

on first one i forgot to copy pg 2 of story.

://.sendspace.com/file/ut8stv

equal justice
COO, Media Director
SOSEN Staff
Member

——————————————————————————–
SELECT PICTURE NAME STATUS ADDRESS ADDRESS SOURCE INFORMATION
Return my Selection as: List Flyer Go
Keys, Clay C.

VIEW FLYER
Released 1008 HANSEN BLVD
PENSACOLA, FL 32505-2845
Show Map Source: Dept. of Highway Safety and Motor Vehicle
Received: 12/11/2007
Type of Address: Permanent

://offender.fdle.state.fl.us/offender/flyer.do?personId=15525
this is tsand. I need all possible info on him. All names used, screen names, all negative stuff

——————————————————————————–
It is certain, in any case, that ignorance, allied with power is the most ferocious enemy of justice-Martin Luther King Jr.

letsgetreal50
Member

——————————————————————————–
I think once all information is gathered it should be sent to the Florida DOC. He is a loose cannon and is exhibiting instability, anti-social behavior that could possibly lead him to re-offend.

Once truth is acknowledged,
it can never be denied.

equal justice
COO, Media Director
SOSEN Staff
Member

——————————————————————————–
Another email I received from the reporter of the story after I wrote and told him his quote was stolen and inaccurate. Interesting.

Ms. Griffiths,

Thanks. I would not have included those quotes if I felt SOhopeful was
being forthcoming with me. My multiple phone messages and an e-mail never
were returned, and I believe the so-called “press release” was only posted
after someone realized a reporter already discovered the Freeman
connection. It was dated 3 p.m. Friday. I had called more than once and
e-mailed Thursday and called again Friday.

I tried to be as fair as possible, but the apparent unwillingness of
SOhopeful to share information with the press made my job very difficult.
Anyway, thanks again for your e-mails and your interest.

Best,
Andrew Gant
The Northwest Florida Daily News
Direct (850) 315-4432
Cell (850) 685-4821
——————————————————————————–
It is certain, in any case, that ignorance, allied with power is the most ferocious enemy of justice-Martin Luther King Jr.

gratefulhoo
SOSEN Staff
Member

——————————————————————————–
So, let me get this straight … because SoHopeful didn’t respond to him, he slammed another organization without even TRYING to make contact?
——————————————————————————–

equal justice
COO, Media Director
SOSEN Staff
Member

——————————————————————————–
I guess so. Who knows if he contacted ROAR and what they would have said. Roar was the org name he used I believe
——————————————————————————–
It is certain, in any case, that ignorance, allied with power is the most ferocious enemy of justice-Martin Luther King Jr.

His dagger buried deep in the heart of the Anti’s is called justice

2008-09-22T22:25:00.000-07:00

To my fellow activists Taking out the garbage

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

To my fellow activists Taking out the garbage
« on: May 28, 2008, 11:10:09 AM »

Hi Everybody
I am going through my memberlist. THe heads and moderators of other blogs and sites, can we get together and SHARE our banned list? Z, Harvard, etc… lets get these moles out of here!
Linda

Harvardphd123
Member

Re: To my fellow activists Taking out the garbage
« Reply #1 on: May 28, 2008, 03:41:17 PM »

Sounds good…………I’ll go get my sledgehammer.

tiggeronmv
Member

Re: To my fellow activists Taking out the garbage
« Reply #3 on: May 28, 2008, 05:19:01 PM »

Not only is it important that the members here at SOSEN depend on our staff to isolate out those who would disrupt our forums, but we as members we must make every effort to use our own discernment. When you feel that someone has said something that may be perceived as an attack, pain10 sit back for a moment, and cool your heals.

If you need to respond, do it off the forum with a personal e-mail.

The action of taking portions of someone’s personal e-mail and then reposting it back into a forum string should never be done or allowed, and when that is done, that post should be deleted by staff since it would allow only one side to be determining what was being seen by all. This is not fair! nono

Please, my fellow brothers and sisters, let us work together for the best of all of us.

In His service,
Tiggeronm blob9

oldman_inmaine
Member

Re: To my fellow activists Taking out the garbage
« Reply #4 on: May 28, 2008, 05:47:20 PM »

For the overall survival of your forum I recommend that you proceed cautiously, for this action could be twisted around to be used as a tool for a great propaganda campaign by the same people that you wish to weed out.

equal justice
COO, Media Director
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: To my fellow activists Taking out the garbage
« Reply #6 on: May 28, 2008, 06:00:29 PM »

We always proceed cautiously happy7

BlackRogue
Member

Re: To my fellow activists Taking out the garbage
« Reply #7 on: May 28, 2008, 06:04:42 PM »

This kind of move is a good one. Yes it may and probably will bring repercussions but it is making them aware that we will not sit idly by anymore and take what they have to dish out. This is our sanctuary, and we should be willing to defend it no matter what. Besides, what can they do to us? Lie, cheat, post our info on the net for all to see. Sorry to say it but the states and the feds beat them to that. They have no power there even though they may think they do. They only have the power that they people they scare and intimidate give them. To quote:

“We have nothing to fear but fear itself!”

Unity is strength, strength is courage and courage is your voice, so let your’s be heard!

ZMan!
Member

Re: To my fellow activists Taking out the garbage
« Reply #9 on: May 28, 2008, 07:36:51 PM »

I’m sure you know this, but BACKUP, BACKUP, BACKUP…. Just in case it’s needed…

It is my opinion we need to start sending emails to the media, politicians, etc about this terrorist group called AZU, and also PJ. But, everyone loves PJ so nothing will probably be done about them. But really, PJ is not the problem, it’s the other radicals out there..

If we send them proof and show who these people are, then maybe they will be looked into… Maybe?

equal justice
COO, Media Director
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: To my fellow activists Taking out the garbage
« Reply #11 on: May 28, 2008, 08:29:00 PM »

In my opinion, giving AZ and the other Anti’s any media or public attention would be a HUGE mistake. Don’t ever even say their name in public. We don’t want to give them any free advertising.

transitions
Member

Re: To my fellow activists Taking out the garbage
« Reply #12 on: May 28, 2008, 08:56:03 PM »

Yes the lessons we have learned. we need to IGNORE, they feed on attention and reaction. It is often hard not to respond when attacked, it is human nature to react this way (I am guilty of this as well). That is what they want. We need to stop, collect ourselves and become silent instead of answer to the assaults. They succeeded in closing down SOA, by using this style of assualt. We need to learn from the mistakes and weaknesses of others to strengthen ourselves personally or/and as a group.

Their day will come when they face their maker, and judgment will be passed upon them. We can not lower ourselves to their standards and engage in the public slander that they choose to thrive on. We are better then that. Engage in the silent warfare, with dignity and self respect.

ZMan!
Member

Re: To my fellow activists Taking out the garbage
« Reply #13 on: May 28, 2008, 09:10:16 PM »

I kind of agree, but I also think they “thrive” on the anonymity as well. If they are not “outed” for who they are, then they will continue to harass, threaten and stalk people and shut down web sites by illegally hacking as well.

But, I agree to an extent. If it got out that they were cyber vigilantes, maybe they’d be looked into further and told to stop. But, maybe I am dreaming…

BlackRogue
Member

Re: To my fellow activists Taking out the garbage
« Reply #14 on: Today at 12:06:44 AM »

From the shadows steals the thief, and his dagger buried deep in the heart of the anti’s is called justice. For just one moment he is no longer a thief but a hero.

Thanks for listening, just feeling deep this evening read2

LetsGetReal-I DO WHAT I DO
Member

Re: To my fellow activists Taking out the garbage
« Reply #16 on: Today at 01:16:16 AM »

Great idea. If you have I.P. Addresses, I would appreciate that very much. Screen names also.

Lets

I DO WHAT I DO!!

Shhhhhhhhh - Know Thy Enemy and place a SOSEN bounty on TSAND’S head

2008-09-21T22:37:00.000-07:00

Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« on: March 05, 2008, 12:27:04 PM »

——————————————————————————–
://sohopeful.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=16015

Sicko KP ring

://.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/crime/orl-bk-childporn020508,0,5529352.story?track=rss

Online child pornography network one of most sophisticated ever
By LARA JAKES JORDAN | Associated Press Writer
6:24 PM EST, March 4, 2008

WASHINGTON - After James Freeman was vetted and approved for membership in what police describe as a highly sophisticated child porn network, he expressed his appreciation by posting two folders online: one labeled “mild,” the other “wild.”

“All I can say is that they are worth the download,” wrote Freeman, 47, known in the global porn ring as ” Mystikal,” according to court documents. “My thanks to you and all the others that together make this the greatest group of pedos ever to gather in one place.”

Freeman, of Santa Rosa Beach, was one of 12 Americans indicted last week in a worldwide investigation that ultimately charged 22 people with participating in the porn ring — and intentionally blocking police from investigating it.

_________________
“Judge me not on one act of my life - do so on of the totality of it.” On the other hand…who are YOU to judge!? “The opinion of 10,000 people means nothing….if they don’t know what they’re talking about” - Marcus Auerilius

Posted: Yesterday, at 4:49 pm

Yes, this is Jim Freeman, aka “Mystikwarrior”
We are shocked, horrified, sad, betrayed, angry

As Caribe rightly put it, this IS a “sicko KP ring” - yes, this was James ‘Jim’ Freeman -or- “mystikwarrior” as many of you knew him. The same “mystik” who answered your legal questions. The same “mystik” who was ready with a witty quip, a snarky jab or a handy quote from some Supreme Court case when the necessity arose. You may have known him from sexcriminals.com - how appropriate…

Former Interim Executive Director Jim Freeman had apparently been actively participating in trading child pornography the entire time unbeknownst to us. No one in SOhopeful had any idea this was occurring. It goes without saying that per common sense and our bylaws he is automatically no longer the Executive Director and is expelled from the organization. We have not, do not and will never tolerate offense or reoffense.

Of course we are absolutely horrified, shocked beyond belief, feel utterly betrayed, angry, disgusted, disappointed and insert any other negative emotion here.

Quote:
Local man caught in child porn ring
Indictment: James Freeman told users he was ‘proud to be a part of it’

Andrew Gant
Tuesday March 4th, 2008
Comment on this Story | Read Comments

PENSACOLA — A Santa Rosa Beach man is one of 12 people indicted in a vast Internet child porn enterprise that investigators say ran for two years.

The U. S. Attorney’s Office has charged James Freeman, 47, with numerous federal crimes: engaging in a child exploitation enterprise, conspiracy, advertisement of child pornography, transportation of child pornography, receipt of child pornography and obstruction of justice.

Prosecutors say Freeman and at least 11 others used large file-sharing networks to share child porn over the Internet and installed “sophisticated encryption methods” to avoid detection.

Freeman’s user name was “Mystikal,” according to his indictment.

The charges were filed after investigators infiltrated the network. By then, the group had already traded more than 400,000 images and videos of child sex abuse, the U.S. Attorney’s Office alleges.

The indictment lists messages posted by all 12 users, many including descriptions of teens or children engaged in sex acts. One describes girls under 10 years old who are “heavily drugged” and abused.

In one message, Freeman posts two folders and claims the pictures inside are “worth the download,” the indictment states.

Later, he thanks the others for their participation: “My thanks to you and all the others that together make this the greatest group of pedos to ever gather in one place. I’m honored just to be a part of it,” according to the indictment.

Two other men were arrested Feb. 29 in connection with the case, but are not named in the document.

If convicted, Freeman and the others each face 20 years to life in prison plus fines.

The case was investigated by the FBI and lawmen in Australia, Germany, the United Kingdom and Canada.

SOURCE: ://.nwfdailynews.com/article/12561

Naturally the following questions arise: How could he? How could he do this to those poor children? How could he do this to us? How could he do this to YOU? Especially when he KNOWS what YOU go through? Especially when he KNOWS how hard your lives are already and what it would do to our cause when he got caught? And the answer are: It’s because he knew but he didn’t care. He knew but he cared only for himself.

Speaking for myself, I feel like Jackie Chan came running at me and karate kicked me in the chest and I want to vomit at the same time. I want to scream and hit him over the head with an iron frying pan. But that would never undo the devastating horror, betrayal, rage or humiliation inflicted upon those children, you, us or those we have all worked and networked with. How we feel is only mildly comparable to how children feel when they are victimized. The horror, the betrayal, the hurt, the rage, the humiliation… and many times they are too small to be able to even have the words to express it, unlike us. But we have the words and we have the venue.

We also have a cause: NO MORE VICTIMS!! And we will use our emotion, not in self-destruction, but we will use it to rebrand, rebuild and move forward. Our credibility is tarnished, but our efforts have not been in vain. Now is the time to pull together, weather the storm and ride it out. We’ve been through rough times before and we’ve gotten through them by focusing on our goals and core principles, pulling together and keeping our noses to the grindstone and not giving up.

We will make changes to ensure that this will not happen again. There will be no more Tom or Jim episodes, and like the Phoenix rising from the ashes, we too will emerge stronger and more focused, for we have learned from this experience.

NO MORE VICTIMS!

Article 2: (updated)
://.guardian.co.uk/world/feedarticle/7357981

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There IS life after sexual abuse
://thereislifeaftersexualabuse.blogspot.com/

static
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #1 on: March 05, 2008, 12:37:10 PM »

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I pray that nothing like this ever happens to our group… We are in a serious fight. It is a public fight, and we have to be above reproach. This is a good time for everyone to reflect on whether they have any skeletons in their closet and clean house now. We not only destroy our own credibility, but that of every member of SOSEN if we reoffend (not to mention destroying all the work that’s been done). Let this be a cautionary tale for anyone who is walking that fine line between legal and illegal behavior- or is having thoughts that you know are leading you in the wrong direction. You will harm more than just yourself and you victim if you reoffend. You will hurt all ex-offenders everywhere- and by extention, the entire country. Yeah- it’s THAT serious. If you have any “issues”, work them out NOW.

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letsgetreal50

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #2 on: March 05, 2008, 12:42:14 PM »

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Perhaps we need to put out a statement of condemnation and support for those at SoHopeful who are indeed fighting the fight.

Lets
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Book38
SOSEN Secretary
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #3 on: March 05, 2008, 01:56:28 PM »

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Some BOD members have already talked about this. Cheryl and I both believe it is SoHopeful’s best interest and OURS TOO…to let this go and rest. No need to try and bring it to light. PJ and AZ will way in on this, but they don’t have a big following. If no more is said, then it will go away in time. Too many new laws are trying to be made in Florida right now. We don’t want to kick the sleeping pit bull!

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equal justice
COO, Media Director
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #4 on: March 05, 2008, 02:16:54 PM »

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If this story gets on our boards, National or South, we need to delete it and pm the person who posted it with the reason why.
This could severly hurt ALL rso groups. WE know PJ AND AZ would LOVE to get their hands on this and make the most of it.
We do NOT want the media to connect Jim and SOhopeful…and we SURE don’t want to help them to do it.
This could have happened to us as easly as to SOhopeful and the fall out will NOT just stay at sohopeful…it will rain down on ALL rso groups.
SO…lets keep as quiet as possible for now…
Shhhhhhhhhhhh
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letsgetreal50

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #5 on: March 05, 2008, 03:08:20 PM »

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Your right, the less said the better. But you can believe that AZ and PJ will get wind of this if they haven’t already. i wouldn’t doubt it if Bill Oreilly does a take on this.

Lets
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static
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #6 on: March 05, 2008, 03:37:32 PM »

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Yeah- but they’re not in our control. How much WE give attention to this is. EJ’s right- SHHHHhhh….

We may have to comment on this if it becomes a big deal, but for now we should just continue with our work and let sohopeful take care of this on their own (at least in public).
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Book38
SOSEN Secretary
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #7 on: March 05, 2008, 08:06:53 PM »

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Can someone sneak over to Shirley’s group and see if Tsand (brownbilly) has found out about this. I would like to know what he or they are saying about this.

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letsgetreal50

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #8 on: March 05, 2008, 08:34:50 PM »

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I tried. It looks like they are cleaning house and deleting accounts of those who only lurk. I see Roar has it posted. I wish they wouldn’t.

Lets
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equal justice
COO, Media Director
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #9 on: March 05, 2008, 09:02:34 PM »

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Tsand knows from ROAR

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topwop
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #10 on: March 05, 2008, 11:38:54 PM »

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We should begin to prepare a statement of support for SoHopeful. It should include a carefully worded condemnation of Mr. Freeman’s alleged actions. I do not believe it is a question of “if” but “when” the public connection is made to SoHopeful.

Yes this hurts all of us in this cause, but fact is some ex-so’s re-offend and yes some lie and dig themselves a deep grave. In time he will realize just what he has done, and begin to understand the betrayal and disappointment he has left behind as his legacy.

SoHopeful will and should continue on. I wish them the best and they have my full support. The actions of one person should not reflect on the group as a whole. We are all in this fight together.

I believe Mr. Freeman is the exception and not the rule, we have all been purged.
Just my opinion.

topwop
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bronkv
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #11 on: March 06, 2008, 12:45:17 AM »

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I agree, that the best course of action is not mention a word about it.

static
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #12 on: March 06, 2008, 12:52:00 AM »

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.. unless we end up having to…

This isn’t to say we shouldn’t be supportive of Sohopeful, but they haven’t been very supportive if us lately, and I’d hate for SOSEN to get attached to this… It doesn’t really matter what the vigilantes say- but it does matter if we issue a statement, and end up getting caught up in the inevitable controversy… As of now, SOSEN is the best hope of seeing any change in the SO situation. We’d be doing ourselves and SO’s everywhere a dis-service if we let ourselves be caught up in this, just for the sake of a unity amongst different groups which doesn’t really exist right now anyway…

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Book38
SOSEN Secretary
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #13 on: March 06, 2008, 01:13:11 AM »

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I have just been over at SoHopeful reading the thread. They are just devastated and I understand why. Jim was the leader over there. He was the pillar to run to for legal information. He was always ready to give you hope for your situation by letting you know about court decisions. He really was a ray of sunshine.

I had to wait to post because I live near Jim Freeman and I needed to stay up and see what the local news had to say. They related the story and at the end, the news anchor said his name and what county he was from. There was no picture of Jim on the news cast and most importantly….there was no mention of him being an RSO or being attached to SoHopeful, let alone the Executive Director.

I have made a few phone calls to Jim in the past year. One was about the lawsuit he had against the state of Florida dealing with the email/IM verification law. The last time we talked, he was about to go to a meeting with the Speaker of the House in Florida. He has an office in Jim’s same town. He was trying to get them to show the U.S how “Smart” Florida could be with it’s new rash of SO laws. I don’t know how well the meeting went as we never spoke after that.

From what I knew of Jim, I would have NEVER thought that he was doing this while being Director of SoHopeful. Linda called me today and waited while I read the email she sent me. I got so physically sick that I could not eat lunch for a long while. I am still very upset!

My prayer is that this will not have an affect on the new rash of SO laws that they will want to use against Florida RSO’s.

But….we just may have to prepare a statement for future use, denouncing Jim’s actions. I will never be concerned if PJ or AZ get a hold of this. They don’t matter as both groups don’t have that large of a following. It’s the news media that I fear. We CANNOT have SOSEN tied into this (lump every RSO into one category mentality). So…..if the media starts to make the connection, we should already have a statement that we can release.

We need to keep SOSEN clean as we may be the only large RSO advocacy group left after the media has a field day with SoHopeful.

Book
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topwop
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #14 on: March 06, 2008, 07:31:36 AM »

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I must agree with Book, and say once again that we as a group “need” not “want” but need to have a carefully worded statement prepared for the possible coming storm.

We do not want to be “reactive” in this situation, we want to be “proactive.”
If we don’t use it then fine. I truly hope and pray we do not have to use it.

You folks in Florida know that when they tell you a hurricane is coming you don’t wait until you see it to react. (we do that here with tornado’s cause there’s nowhere to run except your basement, and their neat to watch)

Another point also is there may be members from SoHopeful that want to distance themselves from this situation and want a place to “transfer their flag” so to speak. We should be prepared for some new members, and be vigilant while accepting them.

“You either fail to plan, or plan to fail.”

topwop

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equal justice
COO, Media Director
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #15 on: March 06, 2008, 07:38:36 AM »

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The pj, AZ groups already have it. I suspect Tsand. He keep emailing me and telling me how they will find out about it and we need to be up front and honest about it, not try to hide. Only he said it worse than that.
It is not a question of HIDING. It is a question of not feeding these guys. YOU cannot talk or reason with them. ANYTHING you say will be twisted or not heard at all. They are the least of my concern.
Like Book said, it is the general media that concerns me. Them and the legislators here in Fl.
It is an excellent idea to prepare a statement just in case we need to use it.
It is very true that it never hurts to be prepared.
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gratefulhoo
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #16 on: March 06, 2008, 04:46:19 PM »

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Did anybody notice that Mzchelle’s post included Jim’s name? Should we modify the post and delete that part?

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lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #17 on: March 06, 2008, 04:48:36 PM »

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Quote from: gratefulhoo on March 06, 2008, 04:46:19 PM
Did anybody notice that Mzchelle’s post included Jim’s name? Should we modify the post and delete that part?

I saw that. But 99% of our membership would not connect the 2

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gratefulhoo
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #18 on: March 06, 2008, 04:52:30 PM »

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Cool. I just wondered if, since it was a repost of the article with the names added, if anybody had seen it.

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equal justice
COO, Media Director
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #19 on: March 06, 2008, 05:36:47 PM »

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Yea thats what I figured too, nobody would know who he is.

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Book38
SOSEN Secretary
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #20 on: March 06, 2008, 10:00:17 PM »

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Doesn’t really matter as SoHopeful makes the connection for everyone. It will get out sooner or later. I just don’t want main stream media CNN or FOX getting the story out. We will have enough problems with the politicians that know. If main stream media gets a hold of this….the general population will scream.

My thinking is that this will come to a head when they start the trial. CNN and FOX will have it plastered all over then. However, we might be able to control the damage some. I had flowergirl scour the internet for the story. Nothing major, but she did find out that 2 of the 12 American’s were RSO’s. That is an extremely LOW number when you put it up against 600,000.00 registered sex offenders. And there were ONLY 24 members of this group out of the entire world that were committing this honorable crime. These figure are on our side and show that not all RSO’s re-offend.

This is the kind of information we need to come up with and keep on hand when we need to answer the up and coming questions.

We will also have ABC’s 20/20 show that will air tomorrow to rely on. Hopefully, their information will report more of the truth.

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letsgetreal50

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #21 on: March 06, 2008, 10:38:11 PM »

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The 20/20 show that was originally entitled “Sex In America,” will air on the 14th entitled “Age of Consent.”

They will “preview” Age of Consent tomorrow. At least thats how I understand it.

Lets

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Book38
SOSEN Secretary
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #22 on: March 07, 2008, 12:18:36 AM »

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Bad timing on ABC’s part. Do I understand correctly that the new name implys only a Romeo and Juliet show? I was under the apprehension that there were going to be 2 shows. The latter would deal with much older RSO’s.

Someone clue me in, I don’t understand.

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letsgetreal50

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #23 on: March 07, 2008, 01:42:07 PM »

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“A Fate Worse Than Death”
March 7, 2008 at 5:54 pm | In Uncategorized |
Tags: Child Molester, Child Pornography, Jan Kruska, Jim Freeman, Roar4Freedom, RSO, Sex Offender Registry, Shirley Lowery, SoClear, SoHopeful, SOSEN, Tom madison

://operationsoroarful.wordpress.com/2008/03/07/a-fate-worse-than-death/

Jim Freeman said:

“Sometimes being a registered sex offender can be a fate worse than death.”

James A. Freeman, aka “Jim” Freeman, “Mystic”, Mystikal”, or Mystikwarrior” is a registered sex offender[1] and RSO activist. In 1997, at the age of 37, Jim was convicted on charges related to the sexual abuse of a child under the age of 16. Part of his sentence required Jim to register as a sex offender after his release from prison. Disgruntled with the newly imposed requirements of his registration, Freeman, along with fellow sex offender Tom Madison, helped to co-found SOhopeful, an advocacy group for sex offenders. In fact, until very recently, Jim served in the capacity of Executive Director for SOhopeful in addition to functioning in the capacity of the groups Legal Director.
The image “://.wikisposure.com/images/6/66/SP32-20080305-221707.gif” cannot be displayed, because it contains errors.

As part of an international sting, Jim Freeman has been arrested by the FBI and indicted by federal grand jury on multiple charges, including: engaging in a child exploitation enterprise, conspiracy, advertisement of child pornography, transportation of child pornography, receipt of child pornography, and obstruction of justice. The U.S. Attorney’s Office will be prosecuting the case.[2]Prosecutors allege Freeman, and at least 11 United States citizens, used large file-sharing networks to share child pornography over the Internet and installed “sophisticated encryption methods” to avoid detection. Over the course of a two-year investigation, the group exchanged over 400,000 images of children, including toddlers, being drugged,raped, and molested. Jim Freeman, co-founder and Executive Director of SOhopeful, a man who repeatedly lobbied for less restrictive sex offender laws, on the premise that sex offenders don’t pose an “imminent danger” to society because they have the “lower recidivism rates than any other crime” was indicted on MULTIPLE counts of child pornography.

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Book38
SOSEN Secretary
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #24 on: March 07, 2008, 01:59:06 PM »

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ROD,

I don’t give a damn what these people have to say…..its not main stream media….who gives a CRAP what the hatters have to say!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

THEY DON”T COUNT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Why did you post this?

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gratefulhoo
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #25 on: March 07, 2008, 02:09:34 PM »

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Quote from: Book38 on March 07, 2008, 01:59:06 PM
….who gives a CRAP what the hatters have to say!!

Would that be the mad hatters?

Personally, I do want to know what they are saying despite the fact that there really aren’t that many of them. My husband subscribes to both Democrat and Republican websites/updates in order to keep abreast of what “the other side” is doing. Not a bad thing, IMHO, as long as we don’t get fixated on it.

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static
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #26 on: March 07, 2008, 02:32:25 PM »

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Book, I’m with you on the fact that what these idiots have to say about the matter is mostly irrelevant as far as society goes. But it’s not so irrelevant for us. It gives us an idea of what propaganda they are going to attempt to feed to the public, and “know thy enemy” is good advice. It also saves me the trouble of hiding my IP to go see what they’re saying myself.

I’ll tell you what’s most amazing about what they said (and what makes it most dangerous to us)- Their post was more fair than almost anything they’ve ever written! Their post could easily pass for real reporting. What they said was true- he was a leader in an organization that advocates against SO restrictions on the basis of low risk. He “disproved” his own arguments. The only thing that was unfair were the tags at the bottom. They linked us and Jan (and anyone else they could think of) with this story, even though we have nothing to do with it, besides having a similar group. But the sad fact is- when this story fully comes to light, we’ll have to deal with the inevitable comparisons. And don’t think for a minute that they were “fair” because they’ve learned how to be objective reporters. They’re doing it to set themselves up as “fair-minded advocates” in the eyes of the legitimate press. Think about it- they will be able to sway public opinion even more against SO organizations, and at the same time increase their stature as “truthful advocates”. It’s quite brilliant, actually, but now that we know their intentions we can strategize more effectively on how best to thwart their efforts (which is why we needed to see the post) .

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Book38
SOSEN Secretary
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #27 on: March 07, 2008, 06:11:38 PM »

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As long as we don’t go overboard with posting there crap here. Personally, I don’t go over there because they have nothing to add to our cause. Also, they have a VERY small following. But they cause trouble with the thoughts they put into our heads.

Hey guys…..listen, we need to be on one page with this as we WILL have to give an answer to those outside of our group one day. It behooves us to have truthful (and factual) information to throw back at those who are asking questions about recidivism due to what this group of people has done to our cause.

I don’t believe it will help us any to listen to the ranting and ravings of lunatics like PJ/AZ. There words have a detrimental effect. Don’t believe me…..go spend some time reading their trash and see how you feel about yourself and your future after word. They have NOTHING to add to our lives or our cause.

And yes Lee Lee…they are “Mad Hatters”…….LOL

Realize that I have different opinions about some matters and some of you have others. I am not always right and neither are some of you. However, PJ/AZ are not in our corner and we in staff and BOD need to be bouncing ideas off each other right now to help with future damage control. You not going to get those ideas from reading their crap.
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gratefulhoo
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #28 on: March 07, 2008, 06:55:20 PM »

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Not to be Switzerland, but I agree with all of these sentiments. I do want to know some of what they say, but I can’t spend much time there. It just makes me sick. They are so evil. I have been pointed to their site to read things many times and have decided to just take people’s word for it. I don’t need to see all of that hatred from the mad hatters.

We do need to be prepared with the whole concept of “one guy doesn’t disprove low recidivism”. If it did, then we would be equating “low” with “ZERO” recidivism. Obviously there is recidivism, relapse, whatever anybody wants to call it. Jim’s behavior does not disprove the FACT of low recidivism. He is just part of that statistic.

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letsgetreal50

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #29 on: March 07, 2008, 08:02:41 PM »

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For informational purposes only.

Quote from: Book38 on March 07, 2008, 01:59:06 PM
ROD,

I don’t give a damn what these people have to say…..its not main stream media….who gives a CRAP what the hatters have to say!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

THEY DON”T COUNT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Why did you post this?

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static
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #30 on: March 07, 2008, 10:17:32 PM »

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(sigh…) Book- you’re right. You know the reason I’ve been on their forums alot lately, and it’s caused me to become very tense and argumentative (y’all may have noticed… haha..).

I can’t keep lurking on their boards- it’s affecting me… sorry. And I’m sorry to everyone who I’ve been a jerk to. (or “to whom I’ve been a jerk” for you grammarians)

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equal justice
COO, Media Director
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #31 on: March 08, 2008, 11:53:59 AM »

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well thanks to tsand and jackass ROAR it has hit the mainstream media now.
It is no longer just AZ site.
the Northwest Fl dailynews has become a freaking free for all.
I cant find a living person to contact there. We are under attack from the haters big time
WE must all remain cool in public but let me tell you I am NOT a happy camper right now

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Book38
SOSEN Secretary
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #32 on: March 08, 2008, 11:07:45 PM »

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Well…..it’s been several hours since the above post and Cheryl and Linda have once again helped to put an end to the trash talk that PJ/AZ and TSAND has done.

HOWEVER>…….there is now a SOSEN bounty on TSAND’S head. Seriously, I am sorry that need to be this way but, TSAND/BCU/MYDOGSPOT/TOESINTHESAND/TOESINTHEMUD….had popped his cork and is a VERY DANGEROUS person. Extremely unstable!!

As we have seen he will continue to take town the RSO Activist community at any cost to our cause. He has to be stopped….and the only way we can do this is to have him removed from the general public and that will more than likely have to be an arrest. I would like to see him placed in a mental institution. He may never get out, but he will be taken care of by a medical staff.
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static
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: Dir of Sohope HEAD of KP RING!!!
« Reply #33 on: March 12, 2008, 06:27:16 AM »

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This is really, really awful… Damn… ://.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,23339978-662,00.html

Face that haunts pedophile busters Print article: Print March 08, 2008 12:00am
IT’S a face that haunts police around the world.

A young girl, probably now nine, who has grown up from infancy on film - thousands of pictures and movies shot of her being molested by an abuser who then shared the images with a network of like-minded internet pedophiles.

As a two-year Queensland-led investigation culminated last weekend with the arrest of 22 people in eight countries, the relief and celebration at busting one of the world’s longest-running and most sophisticated internet pedophile rings was muted by the knowledge that the girl was still out of reach of protection.

Despite the best efforts of Task Force Argos, the Queensland Police Service’s much-lauded child sex unit, and their international counterparts, including the FBI, there are only two things the investigators know about the girl: the country in which she lives and that she is now in real danger.
It is a terrifying truth that yesterday choked up one of Queensland’s most case-hardened policemen.

The Argos chief, Detective Superintendent Peter Crawford, briefly excused himself from his office during an interview when asked about the girl - a “collector’s item” for pedophiles who prize the series that captured her abuse over possibly seven years.

“It is obviously distressing for police to see a young child abused and continued to be abused over a long period of time and not be able to identify or remove them from harm,” he later said.

“Some of these people are collectors, they want a whole series of a particular child growing up, being abused.”

One of Crawford’s inspectors, Jon Rouse, who led the investigation - codenamed Operation Achilles - is blunt about her possible fate.

“The thing is the offender knows we are closing in, we are very worried about her safety,” he said.

Over the next weeks, months and possibly years, police will be analysing more than 400,000 pictures and video files seized in the weekend raids to widen the net on offenders and save more victims.

Already, 40 children - including a four-year-old Brisbane girl - have been rescued through Operation Achilles and its investigatory spin-offs.

The significance of the bust cannot be underestimated.

More than 2500 ‘customers’ in 19 countries of child sex websites have been identified, with 100, including a US reserve police officer and an Australian federal bureaucrat, arrested and charged.

But it is the hardcore network of 22 people, including possibly a few more now under investigation, that is regarded as the coup by investigators around the world.

They were lauded as the untouchables of the international pedophile community.

“They were held-up around the world as the lead players, the ones who could defeat any law enforcement agency, anywhere,” Crawford told The Weekend Australian.

And they were not new to the internet.

While the scope of charges in the various countries have largely been restricted to the past two years, it is believed some have been producing and trading child pornography for a decade - since the explosion of the internet.

The reason they had not been caught, or even detected as a network, was their level of security. To get into the inner sanctum, a member had to go through stages of passwords, highly-sophisticated encryption and codenames. Even the location of their IP servers was disguised. Most, it is believed, didn’t even know the real location or identity of each other.

There was even a guidebook providing the dos and don’ts of avoiding detection and protecting hard drives in the event of a raid. Police had not seen anything like it before.

“What made this group different was the level of security used to protect their identity and restrict membership of the group,” Crawford said.

“They would change their passwords on a regular basis, they would change their encryption keys on a regular basis and use codenames even within the group.”

The level of protection, and years of operating with immunity, allowed them to trade freely and speak openly.

Other, less organised groups often communicate in coded language and trade in parallel, unrelated areas of the internet.

This one didn’t. They boasted among themselves of being able to “defeat” any law enforcement agency in the world.

“This is the greatest group of pedos to ever gather in one place. And I’m honoured just to be a part of it,” one member crowed.

But their seeming invincibility was to be their undoing. It all began to unravel in January 2006 when New Zealand police, who like Argos officers are constantly trawling the internet, came across them.

Police who do this sort of “borderless” work are largely vocational, and don’t worry about jurisdictional rivalries.

They share pretty much everything and often do a lot of each other’s primary investigation because when they initially scope an internet target, they usually don’t know where the person is actually located.

In this case, the NZ police had done enough to recognise there was a group trading in large volumes of child pornography and an Australian may be involved.

Crawford said Argos did a preliminary investigation to establish that it was a job worth doing. “To be honest, we were not sure if we could break through the security, but we wanted to try,” he said.

Crawford is guarded about how it was done, but Argos officers were then able to infiltrate the group.

Argos investigators are empowered to trade child pornographic material, under very strict guidelines, to secure their bonafides with a pedophile ring. In this case, it wasn’t needed.

“We were able to come up with a number of reasons and stories as to why we didn’t - that is our general strategy,” Crawford said.

For the next six months, the Argos officers worked day and night monitoring the group and collecting material. In June 2006 the officers intercepted videos of two girls - aged 9 and 11 - being abused by a man, later found to be their father, somewhere in Europe. The material was sent to Interpol headquarters in France and after more information was provided by Argos, the Belgian abuser was identified and the girls removed.

The trail then led to a professional Italian filmmaker and website creator, who allegedly produced more than 150 made-to-order videos filmed largely in Ukraine. The 42-year-old sold his catalogue - films featuring girls aged nine to 16 - for an average price of $79.

Discovery of the website spawned Operation Koala, named in recognition of its Australian origins and it spread across 19 countries and more than 2500 customers, who paid to download images, were identified and millions of files seized.

In Australia, the Belgian website produced 48 targets and, to date, nine people have been arrested in Queensland alone.

It also led to 24 children being rescued.

One of them was the four-year-old Brisbane girl, whose grandfather had subscribed to the site.

One of the areas of contention between law enforcement agencies around the world is the targeting of subscribers; some forces prefer to target only the big fish, but Argos investigates every single subscriber.

“The difficulty for us is that some people think that a subscriber type of operation is of no value,” Crawford said.

“But any one of those people could be a high level sex offender. When we go to knock on that door, we don’t know what is behind it.”

When police knocked on a subscriber’s door in the outer Brisbane suburb of Kallangur in late 2006, they also found the abuser. The 47-year-old man had convinced his daughter-in-law to return to work on the premise he would babysit his four-year-old grand-daughter. He filmed the abuse and was charged and jailed.

Argos officers were still able to keep their cover inside the secretive network despite publicity surrounding the European website and subsequent string of busts and arrests around the world.

“The filmmaker, his website were just one of many providers for this group, and they just continued on,” Crawford said.

In August 2006 the Argos officer who had infiltrated the group moved to Washington DC to operate from the FBI’s hugely-resourced Innocent Images Unit.

The FBI was stunned that this group - which included 12 Americans - was not only trading in child pornography but generating it.

Many of the victims were children of the offenders. For the next 18 months, the FBI and the undercover Argos officer, as well as another officer sent over to give him support, played the game and collected evidence. They had access to some of the most powerful internet tools on the planet to then track the real locations of most of the members.

In recent weeks they decided they had enough evidence and could go no further without raiding the homes, seizing the computers and then starting the interrogations. The 22 men, some of whom had previous sex offence convictions, were then brought down in simultaneous raids in Australia, the US, Britain, New Zealand and Germany.

“In a lot of cases, these guys were live online on their computers when police went through their doors,” Rouse said.

Among the arrested was an Australian federal government employee, a father of three who is accused of being one of the “key administrators” of the group.

The man, 29, was in charge of vetting new members and monitoring material that was posted within the network. It is believed his children were not victims.

Police won’t talk about the man for fear of jeopardising his prosecution, as well as that of a 50-year-old Victorian man, who is also allegedly part of the group.

Several more members are still in the shadows, including the abuser of the unknown young girl who has appeared in thousands of pictures and videos, and whose image now haunts police officers across the world. Her nationality has not been disclosed in the interests of the operation to rescue her, but police say she is not Australian.

It is a subject that no one likes to discuss.

“There has already been too much said about her, What has happened to her, I can’t bear to talk about,” one officer said.

But Crawford and his team will not give up looking for her. “There is a lot more work to be done, that little girl has not been rescued,” he said.

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To the needy ingrates Cheryl says “screw em”!

2008-09-21T22:08:00.000-07:00

How DARE I interrupt their whining and actually ask them to DO SOMETHING!

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

comments recieved
« on: January 09, 2008, 05:26:31 PM »

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We need to address how we can address folks that want to help but don’t want to be “on” a committee. I have had 4 different people make that comment.

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letsgetreal50
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #1 on: January 09, 2008, 05:34:16 PM »

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They can help by being on a committee. Hahaha!

What kind of help do they want to do?
Write letters?
I’d ask them what THEY had in mind. How do they want to help out??? They need to express what it is they want to do specifically. Want to help? but don’t want to be on a committee? DUH!

Committees will be doing specific things. If what they want to do is being done by a committee than they really need to get involved with a committee where they can be more effective. I think!

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TimF

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #2 on: January 09, 2008, 05:35:46 PM »

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My question would be “How do they want to help?”
Of course, ANY member can make supportive or newsy posts here. ANY member can make replies at news articles that allow comments. ANY member can click that “Donate” button at our Website.
But if they are volunteering to actually HELP, it seems that we created 10 committees to help distribute the load and better organize ourselves in 2008. Are they suggesting that we are missing a needed committee that we hadn’t envisioned?

lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #3 on: January 09, 2008, 05:46:39 PM »

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I am after people that want to do one thing or a hundred things. How will the committees interact with the general membership? We need workers bees! We have to remembers that we are support group AND an advocate group. Some are just entering into this “nightmare”

Linda
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TimF

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #4 on: January 09, 2008, 05:55:52 PM »

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I guess that I see the COMMITTEES as the hive for the worker bees.
If they volunteer for any one committee, they gain the “privilege” of seeing ALL committee work.
This is the [previously unchartered territory] of a stepping stone towards become a member of staff.

While the various committees may overlap and interact, setting up these 10 committees creates separate work hives that allow for focus without getting overwhelmed with the dozens of other actions of other committees (muchless staff).
Focus becomes a tool for both ‘organization’ AND completion of tasks.

As committees progress on task(s), reporting/monitoring is done by staff (especially either our CEO or COO).

As project milestones are reached, staff REPORTS results to our general membership through a number of methods — a newsletterish post in the “News and Announcements” section and/or the actual fruits of the accomplishment (eg.: a boilerplate document for legislators in the Media area; a finished video at our YouTube account; a Written Word op/ed at our Website from the Writers Committee; etc.)

gratefulhoo
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #5 on: January 09, 2008, 06:18:46 PM »

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I really don’t like the “required committee” concept. I, also, have gotten emails from people who want to help as they can but don’t want to feel compelled to be on a committee. I would prefer that they be “interest areas”. I put my name on a bunch of “committees”, but I’ll be damned if I’m going to work full time in all of them. Those are my areas of interest and ability.

I think it puts a lot of pressure on people when they hear the word “committee” and may be reluctant to commit to what they perceive as being too much work. If we presented these more as “areas of interest” in which we need pools of interested people to draw from, we may possibly get more people.

Unfortunately, right now I don’t see much in the way of anybody doing anything. There are very few people posting with any regularity.
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equal justice
COO, Media Director
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #6 on: January 09, 2008, 06:30:14 PM »

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I gotta say Linda that really ticks me off. Oh yea, they want the laws changed, they want their lives better, they want to stay informed about what is going on…but they don’t want to do anything to help, or very little. THey don’t want to “commit”

I gotta say, when people continue to behave like this it really makes me want to say screw em!

Yes we are a support group, and thats a very important function, but support is a TWO WAY STREET! Management could use a little support here. This group of “needy” people RARLY say “good job” or “Thank you” much less step up to the plate and work. I gotta say also, that these are ADULTS. There comes a time when they need to STOP acting and expecting to be treated like babies. I can see it if they are new to the situation, but out of 200 members we should be able to get 20 people who can step up to the plate. I would be happy with 20 measley people out of 200. In my opinion these people need to stop whining and start working. Now, before you make excuses for them, I am not saying everyone! I am just asking for 20 out of 200.

I think I just wasted a whole hell of a lot of my time and energy and some of Tim’s time and energy thinking about, planning and making these committees a reality. I honestly thought these people who said ” I want to help” “Tell me what to do”, “I want to make a difference” were telling the truth and were going to step up. Silly me

What I really need to do is to start just working on Fl. I need to start a major advocacy for FCCC and take care of my son instead of these ingrates who want to sit in their chairs and cry “woa is me” and do nothing else. I need to start taking care of ME and MINE and let the rest of em go to hell!
I have told the members over and over and over and over and over again that we are NOT asking for a time minimum or expecting anything from them that they can not give. And NOBODY said ANYTHING about a “required committee” don’t want to do it? fine, but how about 20 people with some spine! Pressure be damned. THey don’t give a stinking SHIT about how much pressure WE are under, but just let them not like a word said to them or the color of the background of the fourm and they jump all over us.

This is nothing new…it has always been like this…just a few people doing the work, BUT I did expect the people who came here and SAID they wanted to work to be truthful.
I am so upset that I am crying. I was so hopeful. I was realistic. I was NOT expecting even 50 or 100 people to step up. BUT 20!

I think I need to stay the hell away from this place for a while. See ya

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lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #7 on: January 09, 2008, 06:42:00 PM »

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All I asked was, How are the comittees going to interact with the general membership.

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letsgetreal50
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #8 on: January 09, 2008, 07:00:44 PM »

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At this minute there are 7 staff members online and 2 regular members. total for the day 17. I know there were a couple of new people who came and visited. So, all in all, regular members aren’t visiting in droves, much less volunteering for anything.

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lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #9 on: January 09, 2008, 07:06:57 PM »

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We’ve had 50 members visit today

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letsgetreal50
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #10 on: January 09, 2008, 07:11:27 PM »

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Where do you find that info. At the bottom of the Forum Index, it shows who is on like and How many different people visited. If we had 50, then what is this about. Why does it say 17 for today. I’m confused.

Users Online 0 Guests, 12 Users
Users active in past 15 minutes:
letsgetreal50, lindape54, TimF, coolrich001, klpsupermom, Billm, Funkerwinkle, topwop, gratefulhoo, lead_brick_head, aljones, equal justice
Most Online Today: 17. Most Online Ever: 18 (January 07, 2008, 01:13:24 PM)

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lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #11 on: January 09, 2008, 07:19:49 PM »

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Most Online Today: 17. that means at one time today we had 17 people all on at the same time

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coolrich001
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #12 on: January 09, 2008, 07:45:15 PM »

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Back to the original after I make this comment.
Only 10% of any group do 90% of the work. Also, 20% of the group do and will cause 80% of the problems. Those is the facts, Jack!

Now, in another post, I stated that complaints/requests from those who participate will be taken much more seriously. I also said that requests should be put in a polite way. So, when a member asks for something, we should respond in a manner that indicates their participation.

For example, an answer to a request like this, “Thank you for bringing this to our attention. Since you have done this that and the other thing this year for the group, we will make your request a priority. Once more, thanks.”

Other side would be, “We are a volunteer group. Member participation is much needed. We will put your request/concern on our “To Do” list. The more that volunteer, the quicker things get done.”

If members start seeing more and more responses like this, they will get the idea. The workers get the honey!

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letsgetreal50
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #13 on: January 09, 2008, 08:07:26 PM »

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Well shoot, that makes me feel a whole lot better. Now, where do you see, how many were online today totally. I can’t find it.

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gratefulhoo
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #14 on: January 09, 2008, 08:10:13 PM »

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We have absolutely NO RIGHT to think we understand what other people’s lives are like and assume that every person here can and should COMMIT to something. A reluctance to promise to do something over the long haul does not mean that people aren’t interested in helping and doing what they can. We can’t force people to work. It is really harsh to come at this with the attitude of work or hit the road.

As I stated before, I just wonder if we set this up more as just areas of interest, more people may put their names in those areas. Many of us are overwhelmed with our own personal lives. That doesn’t mean that we don’t do everything we can whenever we can. if that’s not okay, then there is a problem. The Type A’s here are going to have to chill while those of us who work best on our own do so.

We can all use direction and suggestions about how to work better and be more effective. Right now, I think this group is too small to overstructure and overstress everybody. I found the posts in National and other groups to be very demanding, and I immediately felt “bossed” and so did some others. My suggestion would be to emphasize the need but not push it so hard.

I have managed volunteers before. I was the Director of Big Brothers Big Sisters, the PTO president for some time, and have served on multiple volunteer boards. Getting volunteers to work is HARD. It’s much easier to get help for a limited project than for the long haul. Soliciting volunteers from a pool of generally interested people works well. Telling people that they must sign up for committees is not successful in my experience.

Can we just consider coming at it from just a little different philosophy?

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lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #15 on: January 09, 2008, 08:40:35 PM »

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The workers bees need their hives. These are the work areas/committee/interest area. What ever we want to call it. Then we have the self starters who accomplish tasks on their own. Al comes to mind with his data base. We could have him add the contact data bases in the proper spots on the forum. Everyone does need a home base, though. Flowergirl is another one that comes to mind. All the worker bees might surprize us. I hope so.

All the worker bees can see what the other bees are working on. We can post to the membership any call to action, projects implimented and completed, etc

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letsgetreal50
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #16 on: January 09, 2008, 08:47:59 PM »

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OK. Tim called and explained how I can tell how many were on line today, yesterday, etc.

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lindape54
SOSEN/CEO
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #17 on: January 09, 2008, 08:50:07 PM »

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Sorry Rod I didn’t see your post. My bad

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equal justice
COO, Media Director
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #18 on: January 09, 2008, 10:22:20 PM »

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Quote from: gratefulhoo on January 09, 2008, 08:10:13 PM
Can we just consider coming at it from just a little different philosophy?

We have attempted to come at it from SEVERAL other philosophy’s with NO success.
I feel like I am speaking a foreign language here that you are not understanding. I have NEVER assumed anything about anyone..and I NEVER expected, demanded, or even HOPED that “EVERY PERSON HERE” could or WOULD COMMIT to joining a committee. I distinctly remember posting RIGHT HERE that I had hoped for 20 out of 200. That is such a FAR CRY from EVERYONE! Again, this is a pretty small “commitment” that I am asking some people for. You are making it sound like they are having to sign a contract and are being asked to work a certain # of hours a day OR ELSE! What utter bull hockey that is. AND YES, I DO have a right to ASK!

I have worked my butt off for these people, I have sat day in and day out at this computer, on the phone, writing and working for THESE PEOPLE. I have made myself SICK physically and emotionally, trying to save SOSEN and make it a worthwhile place for these members. I have opened myself up to public ridicule from other rso groups and from the AZ people. I have neglected focusing on FCCC and Florida to work for the bigger picture. SO YES I HAVE THE RIGHT TO ASK A FEW PEOPLE TO STEP UP AND MAKE A SMALL COMMITMENT THAT THEY CAN CHANGE AT ANY SECOND> DEAR GOD! GET REAL! WE are NOT asking these people for much.
OH they WANT much from us…they EXPECT much from us. BUT ALL WE ARE ASKING FOR IS A SMALL AMOUNT>

I do not know what your problem with me is Lee-Lee. I tried to be a friend and reach out to you as a mother who knows some of what you are going thru and you threw it back in my face and accused me of trying to censure me…and did not bother to respond when I explained that that was not what I was trying to do at all. Why the HELL are you lashing out at ME?

You don’t even know me a little bit. TYPE A personality? I am about the farthest thing you can get from a type A personality. I should “chill” ok fine…but if I had “chilled” before, we would STILL be working for Shirley and be at Yahoo…if there WAS a yahoo since our National forum disappeared and our regional forums were disappearing before our very eyes. If I had “chilled” you would not be here, because you QUIT! and would not work with Shirley.

When you were busy at Christmas did any of us, me included bother you or did we say fine, do what you need to do, we will see you when you have the time again?! AND wish you luck in your business??? Have we EVER harassed ANYONE beyond what they were able to commit to? ABSOLUTLY NOT! The problem with just letting everyone do whatever they want to do on their own when they want to do it is that they don’t do much of ANYTHING! Like I said, we BEGGED for some help last year and got NOTHING.

Does it not make sense to have a group of like minded, talented individuals working as a team on a project??? That would make it easier for everyone. Would any business tell its employees to just come in when they felt like it and do whatever they felt like doing when ever they felt like it? ABSOLUTLY NOT…because NOTHING WOULD GET DONE!!!!! I was simply excited at the PROSPECT of actually getting some worthwhile projects done to REALLY MAKE A DIFFERENCE in a million and a half peoples lives.

NONE of this would have affected MY and MY sons situation. I am NOT doing this for ME!
BUT NO, I am the big bad meanie for ASKING people to step up to the plate…a FEW DAMED PEOPLE! WOW how DARE I be so BOLD as to suggest we get organized and try to accomplish change. HOW dare I interrupt the whining and crying, and whoa is me ing
and the asking others to help them, by asking them to do something. I guess I have got a lot of nerve.

Yea, I have the PASSION to want to make a difference. I have the VISION to see that this is a critical time. I have the BALLS to ask others to get involved and (gasp) committed just a little.
I am the COO of this organization. IT is my job to organize, to see to the day to day running of SOSEN, to see that the VISION and MISSION of SOSEN is carried out and the GOALS met. THAT in itself makes me the bad guy. Linda is the one who holds hands and pats backs and says there there now. I have done my share of helping people too. I just don’t make it public.

Man, I am tired. I am tired of working my butt off for people who don’t give a shit who or how I am. Who don’t care to work to help themselves. I am tired of catching shit for doing what needs to be done. For striving to get things accomplished.

Thanks Lee-Lee, you have helped me a lot. Why the hell should I care HUH? IF no one else does, why the hell should I care.

I am gonna take care of ME and MINE and the rest be damned! I will just slide by just like everyone else does.

I will work ONLY WHEN I DAMN WELL FEEL LIKE IT AND ONLY AT WHAT I DAMN WELL FEEL LIKE WORKING AT! What is good for the goose is good for the gander. Oh and thanks so much for the suport and encouragement. Perhaps if YOU had been around and reading posts, and involved in what was going on, had attended a single staff meeting, you would have been involved in this project and could have voiced your opinion BEFORE I spent the amount of time and energy I did on it.

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gratefulhoo
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #19 on: January 09, 2008, 11:29:31 PM »

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Cheryl, I expressed an opinion because I was concerned that the posts in the forums seems a little heavy-handed and may be off-putting to some people. I had received a couple emails about it as well as sensing it from some posts that I read. I was not criticizing you or attacking you as you just did me in this thread and in your PM. I simply felt that from my experience, the tone of a couple of posts may be too heavy for some people and may scare them off.

If you noticed (but you seem too wound up to read), I supported the concept in the forum in several posts in terms of trying to get people to volunteer and in offering to edit for Rich. I didn’t publicly say I thought this was too much right now.

I did not respond to your recent email because I started a response and then got flooded with all this VA legislation. I have been working on that almost non-stop for the past several days in addition to being sick, having a sick child at home, running my business, and running my other daughter all over town among other life matters. I apologize for not responding immediately. I certainly didn’t think you would take it as a personal afront.

The time I took for Christmas was explained in advance. I make almost my entire yearly income from October through December. I don’t sleep many nights. That is a situation that can’t be helped. I am of no use during that time.

Yes, I did leave Staff before. This was MOSTLY because of Shirley but was also because of the constant bickering in Staff. I don’t have time or energy for that. It is not some kind of GIFT to me to be back. I came back at Linda’s request and after I had explained the constraints on my time. If you don’t want me here, I am happy to leave. You act like I should be so happy to be granted access to the club! I’m not doing this because it is fun or there are some accolades or perks involved! I am here to learn and work. Period. I would suggest that it will be difficult to stabilize the group if it is restructured on a weekly basis because staff can’t function together.

I have not attended meetings because I VISIT MY SON on weekends. Screw it if people don’t understand that every weekend I visit my son one day and spend time with my husband and young children the other day. That is non-negotiable, and I couldn’t care less what anybody thinks about that.

I have not at any point “lashed out” at you Cheryl. You seem very stressed as are we all. Your public attack on me was unwarranted.

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equal justice
COO, Media Director
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #20 on: January 10, 2008, 12:08:54 AM »

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And Lee- Lee I expressed my opinion right back attcha! You were not criticizing me or attacking me? How about

We have absolutely NO RIGHT to think we understand what other people’s lives are like and assume that every person here can and should COMMIT to something.

How about

It is really harsh to come at this with the attitude of work or hit the road.

that was NEVER SAID! or even IMPLIED

Or how about:

The Type A’s here are going to have to chill while those of us who work best on our own do so.

THAT was a really pissy statement…and untrue to boot!

overstructure and overstress everybody.

OVERSTRUCTURE? We have never HAD ANY structure. That was part of the problem. OVER STRESS? These laws that have and are coming down the pike are “stress” asking a few people to simply join a committee and maybe do some work as they are able, should NOT be stress.

I found the posts in National and other groups to be very demanding, and I immediately felt “bossed” and so did some others

My posts were increasingly desperate. They gave concrete examples of WHY we needed to do this. One long standing problem is if you ask our members to do something, then actually REACT when no one does anything, oh yea they get very offended. How DARE I interrupt their whining and actually ask them to DO SOMETHING!

It’s much easier to get help for a limited project than for the long haul.

again ask Linda how many of the projects she asked and asked for help on last year ever got done? How many volunteered?
I am/was simply trying a more organized different approach.

If coming up with a way to be a bit organized and to try to get our members involved, again I am talking about around 20 out of 200, NOT YOUR every one, is so very bad then that is extremely sad.
I agree with you totally about the arguing in staff. It is ridiculous. All we need to do is to support one another, and not attack those trying to get something done.

You KNOW my problem was more that you were VERY nasty to me in response to my reaching out to you in kindness in an email than it was to your not responding to my second email trying to reach out again and explain that I was only trying to be supportive. WE all know you are going thru a bad time now, but I did not create your problems and am NOT the one to take it out on.

As I said before, I am taking some time away from the forum. I am just too upset right now to be here posting, it is not a good idea. My being upset is spilling out into some posts in the Forum and I do not want that to happen. I need to take care of Cheryl for a change. Forgive me for trying to accomplish something here.
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static
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #21 on: January 10, 2008, 12:32:04 AM »

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Ok- well if everyone gets mad at me, so be it. But everyone needs to take their personal differences to PM. And, when dealing with personal disagreements, we should ALL remember that we’re on the same side!!! How much bandwidth are we going to use up trying to win these silly arguments? Sounds like we ALL need a day off- so lets ALL take one! I hardly think the forum is going to fall apart without us for a day…

I know there is history here that I wasn’t part of (thank God!) but what’s happening right now is growing pains. It is a necessary part of the process!!! We can NOT let it become personal.

Let me give you all an outsider’s view– Every single member of staff has their strengths and weaknesses, but EVERY ONE OF YOU are good people doing a largely thankless job. We all volunteered for it, folks! So quit griping. Since it’s a volunteer job, every one of us can do as little or as much as we want. And if we must fight each other, do it privately with the intention of working it out quickly. We have to remember the greater purpose here… I’m not taking sides, just offering some advice. If I’ve made anyone angry, feel free to respond BUT DO IT PRIVATELY so SOSEN doesn’t get bogged down with petty disputes.

P.S. These growing pains are a good sign, BTW- in case you didn’t know…

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topwop
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #22 on: January 10, 2008, 01:10:37 AM »

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Well I had a long letter to post but for some reason it did not post so your getting the short version.

Words like “committee”, “change”, and “commitment” scare off volunteers. Volunteers will do what they “WANT” and feel comfortable with. We are scaring off good members.

IMO!!!!

We do a top shelve job in the support and education department. We need to take this fight to our members instead of waiting for them to come to us and possibly have them miss the one thread that would spur them into jumping in.

We need to get our name out there in the public eye, we need to get credibility.

Information is power. We need to set up a weekly newsletter to send “out” to them. We could ask for input on one or two subjects, digest opinions and finalize things at our weekly meeting. We also could send out template letters for them to simply add their name to and mail. This newsletter could also be copied by our members as a flier to go to prospective members, increasing valuable membership.

The squeaky wheel gets the grease and we have little grease in the gun. We could put our pay pal account button on the letter.

We have 223 members as of now. If everyone donated $10.00 a month that would be $120.00 a year and $26,760.00 for us to do “their” work with.

Lee Lee has a great article that needs to be in print, we had a press release for Britney Spears pregnant sister. Both sit because we do not have the funds. Paper, ink, envelopes, stamps, future rallies, videos, where’s the grease?

Tim tells me we are already set up to do just this. We have writers and we could take turns with the newsletter.

WE “NEED” TO GO TO THEM!!!

Am I nuts?!

topwop

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letsgetreal50
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #23 on: January 10, 2008, 09:07:10 AM »

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Static, your now an insider and words never rang truer when you said,

“Let me give you all an outsider’s view– Every single member of staff has their strengths and weaknesses, but EVERY ONE OF YOU are good people doing a largely thankless job. We all volunteered for it, folks! So quit griping. Since it’s a volunteer job, every one of us can do as little or as much as we want. And if we must fight each other, do it privately with the intention of working it out quickly. We have to remember the greater purpose here… I’m not taking sides, just offering some advice. If I’ve made anyone angry, feel free to respond BUT DO IT PRIVATELY so SOSEN doesn’t get bogged down with petty disputes.”

Static is right, we need some time away from everything to refresh ourselves.
Our problems are really not with each other, but frustration with the lack of membership getting involved. We ’see’ and visualize the importance of these committees. We know, at least in our minds eyes that these committees can and will speed up the process of sosen being a force that will do great things.

It would be ideal if we had 200 eager members, even 20, just biting at the bit to join a committee to do SOMETHING. But that’s not the case. I believe that is where the real frustration comes in at.

We’ve been through worse than this and have come out stronger for it.

When I had my contracting business in California, I had to go through at least 40 people to find that one. But when I found that one, what a difference it made. In fact, I showed my appreciation by giving raises and bonuses.

I thank God for every committed member of Staff and National. You are the glue that holds this organization together. You are the worker bees whether you like it or not. You are the few. We can only work with what we have and go from there. Perhaps we just need to start from there and hope and pray that we can attract individuals like Static, and a few other new people who are personally committed to this fight.

There are way too many RFSO and Family who are not in this fight at all. And that is frustrating to say the least. We need talent and money. Perhaps a few more NPR programs are in order. We do need to find talent who is willing to work for free. Not much incentive there.

So, consider taking a break. Get refreshed in mind and spirit. The year has just begun.

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equal justice
COO, Media Director
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #24 on: January 10, 2008, 01:39:11 PM »

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TOP,
That is my point exactly. WE NEED FOCUS GROUPS> things just keep getting lost, passed over, not focused on, missed, and whatever else. This is an AGE OLD PROBLEM it is not new. IT SEEMS TO BE INHERENT IN RSO GROUPS> ALL I was trying to do was get organized, for God’s sake so this would STOP happening. If what I have asked for in MEMBERSHIP will “scare off members” then we are in very sad shape and need to simply focus SOSEN on being a simple support group.
These people need to grow up and start acting like adults. Yea, some of them are fresh in the RSO process and need some hand holding and support….many are not and have just been whining for years, and the most work they are doing is coming up with excuses NOT to work. I have said NOTHING SCARY! I have not asked anyone to sign a contract saying they would be required to do thus and so or else dire consequences would occur.

WE have OVER 200 members and TWO have stepped up…that are from general membership.
SO, fine, we can just continue as we have all along and the stuff can STAY not getting accomplished. NO skin off my back.

I am real tired of being the bad guy around here, I’m done.

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letsgetreal50
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #25 on: January 10, 2008, 01:49:42 PM »

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Cheryl, you are certainly NOT the bad guy around here! You are one of the few who actually gets things done. If sosen turns into nothing but a support group for the emotional handicapped then I’m out of here.

I know that won’t happen. Support is important but at some place in their lives, they need to learn to quit being an eternal child and grow up.

We, have work to do. Nothing gets done without someone doing it. Things just don’t happen in a vacuum! You are one of the shakers and movers that is propelling sosen into the future. Please don’t ever forget that. We are moving in different directions at one time. Support and fight on every front. We are going to make big advances in 08. WE WILL!

Lets

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TimF

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #26 on: January 10, 2008, 01:55:32 PM »

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Quote from: topwop on January 10, 2008, 01:10:37 AM

Words like “committee”, “change”, and “commitment” scare off volunteers. Volunteers will do what they “WANT” and feel comfortable with. We are scaring off good members.
…
Information is power. We need to set up a weekly newsletter to send “out” to them. We could ask for input on one or two subjects, digest opinions and finalize things at our weekly meeting. We also could send out template letters for them to simply add their name to and mail. This newsletter could also be copied by our members as a flier to go to prospective members, increasing valuable membership.

The 90% that are ’scared’ by the words like committee, change, and commitment are the 90% we don’t want or need to have access to our committees which are the WORKING groups that our organization NEEDS in place.

The 10% that already DO WORK (and are NOT on staff) should NOT be scared of these words — as there is no minimum committment of time involved.

The very suggestion of a newsletter, templates, fliers, etc. have been ‘projects’ that staff has talked about for a YEAR now. These are the very reasons WHY we need committees that allow a larger group than just the roughly 15 of us on staff to help spread the load.

Volunteering for a committee — ANY committee — should be seen as a PRIVILEGE! It will allow that particular member to be more apprised of ALL committee work. It will allow them to feel that they are ‘giving back freely what was given to them’ and feel that trust and respect implicitly. This IS a STEPPING STONE for our regular members to be MORE active and apprised of the internal workings of SOSEN — without giving them FULL ACCESS to all the sosenSTAFF discussions, planning, arguments, and distractions.

I dislike the infighting (and I’ve certainly been a part of that in the past — so I’m not innocent of this problem). But I was MORE put off by the original question of addressing HOW we deal with people that want to help but NOT be on a committee. It just seemed like a no-brainer — they EITHER want to help or they don’t. An offer of helping us gives THEM additional access and privilege — simple as that — and take it or leave it.

Of course, STAFF benefits too. We have MORE brainpower. We have a place to do work that the membership (lurkers and especially miscreants) cannot see UNTIL a task reaches a milestone. We can put the dozens of projects staff likes into a committee and allow the task to unfold (in its own time) by those specifically interested in that project.

Win-win. I like this. Let’s not be put off by those few that are scared of work — as they will NOT LEAVE the main group for this. They are just NOT the ones we want to have working on our committees and projects.

coolrich001
SOSEN Staff
Member

Re: comments recieved
« Reply #27 on: January 10, 2008, 03:28:15 PM »

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And, when the “do nothings” want something done, their request will be waaaaay behind the “do somethings”.

Handling Zman with Kid Gloves, Chill Pills, and Tummy Pats

2008-09-19T22:00:00.000-07:00

E-mail From Zman

letsgetreal50
E-mail From Zman
« on: December 13, 2007, 04:13:34 PM »

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From Zman. Did anyone else get this and was it taken care of

(No subject)
« Sent to: letsgetreal50 on: December 10, 2007, 10:57:15 PM »
Reply with quote Reply Remove this message
Please DELETE this profile. That is my real name, and some vigilante asshole is apparently trying to use it for who knows what…………………

equal justice
COO, Media Director
SOSEN Staff
Member

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Yes I did and it was…there was nothing to it. It was innocent. Z needs to take a chill pill

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letsgetreal50

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He needs a bottle of chill pills to be taken hourly or as needed. lol

Book38
SOSEN Secretary
SOSEN Staff
Member

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Staff needs to handle him with Kid Gloves. He is a very valuble member, but he can be skitzy. I always tell him that I will look into it for him and explain that staff has certain ways to handle these situations. He normally will give us the space we need to do a small investigation and thereby doing what is necessary. Whatever that may be. Just pat his tummy from time to time. He is doing all of us GREAT good with his blog.

I am more than willing to put up with his personality traits.

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letsgetreal50

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Oh, I agree and for all the reasons mentions.

Operation So Roarful

SOSEN: Distorted Worldview and Deplorable Methodology

Nambla - Who we are

RSOL - The How

RSOL - The Why

Walking into Stitches hands

AZ/PJ Never got past the front door

AZ/PJ Never got past the front door

The ex coo said “I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I”

Friday, October 31, 2008

The ex coo said “I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I,I”

“East German Stasi” Part 1- Sosen deletes posts and rips new ones

Sosen isn’t the Gestapo “Put up or shut up”

This stays in staff

Margie Slagle tried to help the situation - Sosen silenced her

It is NOT “them” Cheryl, it is you

*I* am the CEO and she’s *MY* Sarah Tofte

Cyber Warriors - a vigilant group of extraordinary individuals

Cyber Warriors - a vigilant group of extraordinary individuals

Iron Fist Linda, If you don’t like it “Smite Me”

Rod was gonna turn this shit around and shove it up their ass with the help of Tmaximus95

Cheryl Griffiths Attempts to Cover up her Cover-up Attempt

His dagger buried deep in the heart of the Anti’s is called justice

Shhhhhhhhh - Know Thy Enemy and place a SOSEN bounty on TSAND’S head

To the needy ingrates Cheryl says “screw em”!

Handling Zman with Kid Gloves, Chill Pills, and Tummy Pats

I am the CEO and she’s MY Sarah Tofte